[alxw0w]

An HD600 + a $200 dac/amp is all anybody actually needs to enjoy music . This isn’t about music. It’s about endless gear chasing and tweaking to chase an imaginary state of perfection that lasts until the next new product is announced. I’m not immune to this either….

Have to disagree. Have you compared hd600 to for example Stealth? You can EQ hd600 as much as you can, but it won't sound the same.
Clarity, soundstage/spatial effects separation of the notes is top notch on the Stealth. Of course you can still enjoy hd600 (actually it's my second pair of headphones and I really like them) but it's not in the same league as Stealth (both objectively and subjectively)

Another matter is if somebody wants to spend that amount of money for headphones - don't get me wrong it's expensive, but some people see value and are willing to spend their own money, nothing wrong with that.
Of course there is a lot of gear in our hobby that doesn't perform (objectively) on par with it's asking price but headphones from Dan Clark are the exception.

 

[rthomas]

Have to disagree. Have you compared hd600 to for example Stealth? You can EQ hd600 as much as you can, but it won't sound the same.
Clarity, soundstage/spatial effects separation of the notes is top notch on the Stealth. Of course you can still enjoy hd600 (actually it's my second pair of headphones and I really like them) but it's not in the same league as Stealth (both objectively and subjectively)

Another matter is if somebody wants to spend that amount of money for headphones - don't get me wrong it's expensive, but some people see value and are willing to spend their own money, nothing wrong with that.
Of course there is a lot of gear in our hobby that doesn't perform (objectively) on par with it's asking price but headphones from Dan Clark are the exception.

Of course they won’t sound the same, I own three flagships, I’m not against them or their benefits. I’m just saying a very inexpensive system gets you 90% of the way there. Won’t say more , don’t want to pollute the thread

 

[alxw0w]

Of course they won’t sound the same, I own three flagships, I’m not against them or their benefits. I’m just saying a very inexpensive system gets you 90% of the way there. Won’t say more , don’t want to pollute the thread

We are cool.
Also I agree that nowadays you can get very very good sound with headphones with relatively low money.
Won't say more don't want to pollute the thread

 

[xirxes]

Of course they won’t sound the same, I own three flagships, I’m not against them or their benefits. I’m just saying a very inexpensive system gets you 90% of the way there. Won’t say more , don’t want to pollute the thread

I will say that you can get a very specific sound, maybe a set that does one particular audio trick VERY well at low prices, requiring you to either attempt the EQ miracle or own 3-4 entry level cans to cover the gamut of sounds (1x SS, 1x imaging, 1x bass head, 1x resolution) but a true TOTL can bring almost all of these into focus in one single package.

As to whether Expanse fits that bill is in the ear of the beholder.

 

[Dixter]

my final post.... congratulations Dan on another nice headphone... they do look great and I am a fan of DCA products..
from a poor DCA fan... wish you could come up with a lower priced headphone with some of the new tech included... best of luck all...

 

[Muataz]

My experience here is that of a 50-70% increase in width, possibly 20-30% in depth between the two.

It is quite a different experience, but certainly more in degree than in kind, and certainly not an opposite reaction.

Again, understanding my bias from closed can world only, the Expanse has me chasing the perfect volume every upward, while the stealth I tend to be searching the lowest volume to suit on the same track. This is not just the sensitivity difference but a difference in the feeling of full energy retained inside Closed cup vs the feeling of the airiness and escaping sound energy of open.

I think with open headphones, I need very very quiet room to really hear what the open design can do.

 

[xirxes]

I think with open headphones, I need very very quiet room to really hear what the open design can do.

You may be very impressed with these then, as the super low distortion and they AMTS create almost a hybrid effect of closed-like partial energy retention while still adding all that air.

 

[801evan]

I'm glad Dan stuck to his guns and gave even more perceived upper mids. Too many people complaining about the 'harman ear gain edge/peak' but ironically the ones they like is more peaky and hard for me while Stealth is more calm.

Congrats to DCA.

 

[elira]

my final post.... congratulations Dan on another nice headphone... they do look great and I am a fan of DCA products..
from a poor DCA fan... wish you could come up with a lower priced headphone with some of the new tech included... best of luck all...

Just wait a few years, new tech takes time to become affordable. I’m curious to see if other companies follow the AMTS approach, so far DCA is the only one doing that. If more companies use that technology then there will be more competition and prices might go down.

 

[adrianm]

I am not a fan of the fairly constant byline of scrutiny of “bass slam, macro dynamics, foot tappiness” that is all the rage around discussing DCA products. Mainly because I have experienced that both Stealth and Expanse as well are highly chain dependent and you get out of them everything you put in. Unlike many other designs where they perform fairly uniformly across the spectrum of input, if one reviews Expanse on a D90/A90 stack, you will just NOT be hearing what I’m hearing on a TT2/Enleum 23R. So that said….

In my chain I always had the full range of macro dynamics that I could want including PLENTY of bass in all varieties and quality in Stealth, where the regular lineup of VC, Rognir, Denon, even 1266TC always came across as over emphasized bass, and for VC and especially Rognir, boomy and muddy bass.

In the Expanse I think emphasizing the bass 100-250hz was a good play to retain all of that amazing quality and correctly balanced quantity of bass present on the Stealth, while allowing sound energy to be lost in the open back design. The macro dynamics to me are excellent and these are if anything creating a greater inherent natural and “real” presence of the music to give even more macro dynamic fun to the mids and treble in space.

Still, most Stealth owners *****foot around this and try to convince the rest that macro dynamics (or "slam") don't matter. It matters to a lot of people. Erm, Abyss?
All I can say is just like with most things, people get holier than thou about the latest thing having lower distortion and being the "real" sound, yet they add distortion via cables or amps. Case in point, the Enleum actually has higher distortion than the headphones (what a time to be alive!) so I get why it doesn't feel lacking to you, and the others feel boomy.
Agreed, everything is chain dependent, but I can tell you even using Dave + Oor with Susvara it still didn't have the impact the Elites do. Just like Elites don't have the impact the Z1R do, etc. And Dave + Oor doesn't have the dynamics Lina + Oor does.
It's all relative, but it scales with most, if not all headphones. I didn't jump on the Stealth bandwagon because of this, however I would consider the Expanse (Good job not trademarking it dCS ) If It didn't turn out to be as limp as people are describing the Stealth (or just passable on an ideal amp).
I'm definitely waiting to see some more objective opinions considering how polarizing Stealth is.

 

[xirxes]

Still, most Stealth owners *****foot around this and try to convince the rest that macro dynamics (or "slam") don't matter. It matters to a lot of people. Erm, Abyss?
All I can say is just like with most things, people get holier than thou about the latest thing having lower distortion and being the "real" sound, yet they add distortion via cables or amps. Case in point, the Enleum actually has higher distortion than the headphones (what a time to be alive!) so I get why it doesn't feel lacking to you, and the others feel boomy.
Agreed, everything is chain dependent, but I can tell you even using Dave + Oor with Susvara it still didn't have the impact the Elites do. Just like Elites don't have the impact the Z1R do, etc. And Dave + Oor doesn't have the dynamics Lina + Oor does.
It's all relative, but it scales with most, if not all headphones. I didn't jump on the Stealth bandwagon because of this, however I would consider the Expanse (Good job not trademarking it dCS ) If It didn't turn out to be as limp as people are describing the Stealth (or just passable on an ideal amp).
I'm definitely waiting to see some more objective opinions considering how polarizing Stealth is.

I’m sourcing Abyss 1266TC to A/B hopefully today for rest of week directly against Expanse for all the bassholes out here.

In my experience the abyss, although impactful has less done right than the stealths overall, and distorts in odd ways. I also cannot listen to them for more than an hour, where both Stealths and Expanse don’t have this issue.

 

[dfiled]

Still, most Stealth owners *****foot around this and try to convince the rest that macro dynamics (or "slam") don't matter. It matters to a lot of people. Erm, Abyss?
All I can say is just like with most things, people get holier than thou about the latest thing having lower distortion and being the "real" sound, yet they add distortion via cables or amps. Case in point, the Enleum actually has higher distortion than the headphones (what a time to be alive!) so I get why it doesn't feel lacking to you, and the others feel boomy.
Agreed, everything is chain dependent, but I can tell you even using Dave + Oor with Susvara it still didn't have the impact the Elites do. Just like Elites don't have the impact the Z1R do, etc. And Dave + Oor doesn't have the dynamics Lina + Oor does.
It's all relative, but it scales with most, if not all headphones. I didn't jump on the Stealth bandwagon because of this, however I would consider the Expanse (Good job not trademarking it dCS ) If It didn't turn out to be as limp as people are describing the Stealth (or just passable on an ideal amp).
I'm definitely waiting to see some more objective opinions considering how polarizing Stealth is.

Yes, I don't feel apologetic about prioritizing macrodynamics. There are plenty of planars with great clarity, and I personally barely care about conformity with Harman as I have no issue using EQ. Quality slam and punch is notably lacking in most planars I've heard (I've never heard the TC's -- that seems to be a notable exception) and I'd be unlikely to buy another pair of planars based purely on its tuning.

 

[dfiled]

I’m sourcing Abyss 1266TC to A/B hopefully today for rest of week directly against Expanse for all the bassholes out here.

In my experience the abyss, although impactful has less done right than the stealths overall, and distorts in odd ways. I also cannot listen to them for more than an hour, where both Stealths and Expanse don’t have this issue.

Can't wait to hear your impressions!

 

[XERO1]

 

[adrianm]

Yes, I don't feel apologetic about prioritizing macrodynamics. There are plenty of planars with great clarity, and I personally barely care about conformity with Harman as I have no issue using EQ. Quality slam and punch is notably lacking in most planars I've heard (I've never heard the TC's -- that seems to be a notable exception) and I'd be unlikely to buy another pair of planars based purely on its tuning.

If I did get something for the tuning , I'd be much more curious about the Raal Ca-1a tbh.