[elnero]

Well I'm looking at upgrading my source again. It's not that the Dialogue II is bad, quite the contrary, I like it quite a bit but it does have a few shortcomings that I'd like to improve upon. My main concern has been in the bass, the level of bass is generally quite good but it lacks some oomph if you well and it can be a bit slow and muddy on some recordings. More detail retreival wouldn't be a bad thing either but I guess my main area of concern is related to the bass and the overall drive.

I know my transport plays a part in this and I'm looking at options there but for the most part I'm limited to a DVD player. The problem I've had finding anything is I need a DVD player with DivX capabilities, there's a new Cambridge Audio DVD player that looks to be a contender but it's very new and I've not much information/feedback on it as yet.

My budget for a new DAC is $500 or under and at this point I've narrowed it down to two, a Lite DAC-60 or Storm Digital D02.

The Storm Digital like my Dialogue II is a non-oversampling DAC using the same TDA1543 DAC but instead of just a single chip it uses 8 in parallel which in theory should help the output as well as the linearity. It looks to be better built, with better parts so with all these things I expect it would address my concerns with the Dialogue II and improve on a sound I know I like.

In talking with the builder of the D02 he has indicated that an upgraded clock option as well as an AC only "lite" version will be available in the near future. I'm not sure how I feel about the battery power anyway so the savings on the "lite" version could potentially make up for the cost of the upgraded clock.

Things that bother me about the D02 is will it really be what I'm looking for or will it still have the same shortcomings the Dialogue II has.

The Lite DAC-60 on the other hand uses a 24 bit PCM1704U-K and two 6922 tubes in the output. This setup for some reason reminds me of the MiniMax, I'm not sure if they would even sound similar but that's the impression I get from it. While I sold the MiniMax, it paired with the GS-1 was probably the best system I've heard but I couldn't afford to keep both so the DAC-60 is appealing for that reason.

Of course there are a few things that bother me in regards to the DAC-60 as well. One is a few reports that the DAC is really the lesser PCM1704U not the better U-K version but these are unsubstantiated and probably impossible to prove or disprove. The other thing that bothers me is the size, I have limited space and this thing is much bigger than the Dialogue II, I could make it work but probably get some frowns from my wife. The last thing that concerns me is the tubes. While I consider myself a tube lover they're not very conducive to my listening habits because sometimes I'll only get to listen for short periods of time so would the tubes even really get warmed up? I know this became a bit of a problem with MiniMax when I had it as I became reluctant to turn it on for those shorter sessions.

Those are my two main options but I have a couple of others as well.

First would be instead of a DAC go with a CD player in the $500 region. This isn't terribly appealing but I did come across a used Arcam CD73T locally that would be within my price range. I've never heard this particular model and it's far enough away that I can't get an audition but I have always been intrigued by the descriptions of this player and supposedly it makes a decent transport as well.

The second option is a bit more extreme and would involve selling my whole existing system to get a Lavry DA10 for use as an all-in-one. While this is probably the best source I could afford I assume I would be talking a step back in the amp department and I'm not sure if I could give up my GS-1 not only for it's sound but it's versatility. Considering there may be some changes to the DA10 in the near future I wouldn't do this right away anyway, instead I'd probably try one of the above solutions until Lavry finalizes it's plans for the DA10.

Ok, so explaining my options by typing this post was probably more theraputic than anything I would still appreciate any advise or suggestions whether they involve the products listed above or some other option that would be feasible given my limited space and budget.

 

[elnero]

Ok, Lets throw another option out there. What about an Apogee Mini-DAC as a potential all-in-one solution? I don't know that much about the Mini-DAC so any input would be greatly appreciated. What I have heard or read can be a bit conflicting, some say the internal headamp is quite good while others say it's just fair. One thing everyone seem to agree on though, it has a very good synergy with Grado's.

So what else is going on inside there, is it an upsampling DAC or does it just accept and convert higher clock/bitrates as well? What are the dimensions? If I recabled the RS-1's could they be used directly out of the XLR's?

 

[akwok]

Few more days.. and I can let you know. I plan on nabbing a bunch of other DACs too to test out..

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

When Mike modds the teac vrds9, he takes out all but one of the dac chips per side, so an increase in the number of dac chips is not universily considered better.

Biggie.

 

[elnero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by NotoriousBIG_PJ When Mike modds the teac vrds9, he takes out all but one of the dac chips per side, so an increase in the number of dac chips is not universily considered better. Biggie.

In this case the the DAC has a passive I/V stage so more DAC's means a higher output, generally speaking that should be better because the output of a single TDA1543 is on the low side. That and from all I've read stacking TDA1543's is considered a good thing not only for the output but for linearity. Part of what I feel is suffering in the Dialogue II could possibly be traced to the low output passive I/V of the single TDA1543. I tend to think the difference might be akin to properly powering HD650's, bass should be the big benefactor becoming tighter, punchier and better defined. Of course if I'm wrong in this assumption please say.

 

[jriihi]

I considered that lite dac-60 also. I finally then went with $488 total including shipping modded diyeden great-march solution

Its different than other ppl here have atleast..

 

[Jon L]

What's the problem here? Resolve the problem in true Head-Fi fashion:

Step1:
Sacrifice the non-essentials of life, such as eating out, movies, dates, books, clothes, etc, and work extra hours to save up the $.

Step2:
Buy everything. Max out debit cards and credit cards and don't look at the bills.

Step3:
Compare and keep the ones you like.

Step4:
Sell off the ones you don't want at a huge loss here at Head-Fi, to benefit the poor souls who look at the For Sale section every 20 minutes.

 

[elnero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jriihi I considered that lite dac-60 also. I finally then went with $488 total including shipping modded diyeden great-march solution Its different than other ppl here have atleast..

I've seen the diyeden DAC but haven't been able to find very much information in English about it, do you have a source?

In fact I also considered a Zhalou but for one I have no use for the headphone amp so that would be redundant. I emailed the builder about getting one without it and a plain black faceplate in place of the silver with volume control and headphone jack. He indicated that it was possible but due to the language barrier I couldn't figure out whether he meant it would be possible to put a new faceplate on the existing case or if it would have to be put into the bigger case he uses for people who want all the upgrades. Shortly thereafter I came across a thread about the Storm Digital and the Zhalou moved to the background.

Jon L, very helpful and informative post.

 

[jriihi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by elnero I've seen the diyeden DAC but haven't been able to find very much information in English about it, do you have a source? In fact I also considered a Zhalou but for one I have no use for the headphone amp so that would be redundant.

Well you can use some translation like google translate if you find some info in google. I can post some links when i get home.

Yeah i went with diyeden great-march dac mainly because didnt need headphone amp. I think it has 1x toslink and 2x coax digital inputs+1x usb.. atleast looking at backplate input section.

 

[elnero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jriihi Well you can use some translation like google translate if you find some info in google. I can post some links when i get home. Yeah i went with diyeden great-march dac mainly because didnt need headphone amp. I think it has 1x toslink and 2x coax digital inputs+1x usb.. atleast looking at backplate input section.

I've been looking into the diyeden a bit the past little while but I don't find anything about it terribly interesting from what little I can make out from the Babelfish translation. Even all the inputs seems a bit useless because it doesn't look like there's any selector switch.

 

[edisonwu]

Phil,

The second batch of DA10 are ready to serve this week...I like it very much even as a all-in-one solution. The internal headphone amplifier provides more that enough current so it should drive your RS1 very well.

 

[elnero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by edisonwu Phil, The second batch of DA10 are ready to serve this week...I like it very much even as a all-in-one solution. The internal headphone amplifier provides more that enough current so it should drive your RS1 very well.

I guess what this comes down to is not just which DAC but which system as a whole gives me the best overall sound and options given my budget and other limitations. I expect the Lavry is the best DAC of the bunch but how does it's headamp stack up against that of the GS-1 not to mention the versatility the GS-1 offers? Would one of the DAC's I listed paired with the GS-1 offer a better overall sound as a system? This is kind of what I had to do when evaluating the MiniMax vs. the Dialogue II + GS-1. I would say the MiniMax as a source alone was better than the Dialogue II and pairing the MiniMax with the GS-1 was awesome but ultimately unnaffordable for me so it came down to the Dialogue II + GS-1 vs. the MiniMax and it's internal headamp. In the end that was a pretty close call but I went the route I did for added versatility.

Oh and I was aware that another batch of DA10's was shipping soon but there is talk of some other revisions, most notably the possible addition of a remote volume, which I would be very interested in so I've been holding off on any decisions regarding the Lavry until I jear what they ultimately decide to do with it. I don't expect that will happen for some time though so in the interim I was thinking of giving one of these others a try to see where that gets me.

 

[jriihi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by elnero I've been looking into the diyeden a bit the past little while but I don't find anything about it terribly interesting from what little I can make out from the Babelfish translation. Even all the inputs seems a bit useless because it doesn't look like there's any selector switch.

Yeah input are auto selected. So if you got signal always coming to multiple inputs then its useless. Also please note that my version is not stock unit. It has these mods:
"analog output opamp: OPA627 Metal housing (TO-99) class A amplication sell resembled dual kit"
"upgrade the power supply with Black cap, Elna for audio cerafine cap, Os Con cap, WIMA cap, Holco 1% metal film resistor."

 

[mttr0]

jriihi: YGPM, thanks!

 

[elnero]

Uggghh, got a reasonably good deal on a Lavry DA10 here in Canada. The company is also offering a 14 day return with no fees I just have to pay shipping. Only problem there is shipping will potentially run upwards of $100 or a bit more so if I decide against it that's $100 less I have to put towards another DAC. The Lavry I expect is the best source of the lot and probably one of if not the best under $1000 but the dilemma becomes how does it compare as an all-in-one to either a Storm Digital D02 + GS-1 or Lite DAC-60 + GS-1? And if the Lavry is the better overall system is it a big enough difference to give up the level of flexibility the other DAC's + GS-1 would offer? Of course with limited space though the Lavry as an all-in-one has it's benefits as well.

As the title says, decisions, decisions...