Grado Bowls vs. Hd414 Pads
Aug 1, 2006 at 8:14 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 22

feh1325

Headphoneus Supremus
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Before I start the comparison, let me say that I am very new to headfi and music as a whole. The rig I will be using is the same in my signature; 4G ipod headphone jack – pa2v2 amp – a maxell headphone splitter to reduce jack stress from the – ratshack 6.5mm to 3.5mm adaptor – Alessandro ms2i. As a final note, the following will be my personal comparison and results will vary from person to person.

I stopped using my bowls when my hd414 pads. I shampooed them twice then once with fabric softener. My hd414 pads have been treated with only fabric softener. Also, I put some packaging foam on the headband. Both pads are unmodded.

Comfort
Bowls- I get a very loose clamp and fit from my bowls. I guess I have small ears because the pads make contact with only my earlobes. The white mesh makes contact with the most outer parts of my ears and causes discomfort after a half an hour of listening. After a half an hour, I just take them off for a couple seconds and I’m fine.

Hd414- The hd414 pads make these headphones very comfortable. The clamp and fit is ever so slightly snugger to get more of an intimate feeling. I can wear these for about an hour and a half until I need a short break to shake if off. Not literally, I take care of my possessions.

Sound- I will try a couple tracks and compare in terms of the hd414 pads because I am more familiar with them

Money by Pink Floyd on “A Collection of Great Dance Songs” 320kpbs mp3
The first thing I noticed was the increased soundstage. The vocals seem further away and there are more “layers” of sound. Crash cymbals seem splashy and more live. The bowls are leaner on the bass with more of an impact rather than the full length of the note. To sum it up in more musical terms, a little bit of staccato.
Now to my favorite part of the song and my favorite guitar solo
The guitar seems far away like I’m at a concert with lawn seats. I like the presentation my hd414 pads. The bowls give you less of an in your face feeling. I can’t compare it to any other grado because I have never heard any others. But, my unmodded ksc75 give a more solid guitar solo than the bowls. But this is just a personal preference.

The Millionaire Waltz by Queen on “A Day At the Races” 320kbps mp3
The song as a whole is softer with less impact and edge. The bass is once again leaner. More like jabs rather than pushes. The backup vocals sound airy. There is more emphasis on the percussion, specifically, the toms. Brian May’s Special Red “shines” more with the bowls. There is once again, more soundstage. The bowls lack just a little bit of detail due to their airy-ness. The backup vocals sound fantastic towards the end.

The first movement “Jesus of Suburbia”, up to around 3:40 of Jesus of Suburbia by Green Day on “American Idiot” 320kbps mp3
This songs opens up with a series of shots. The cymbals have more presence and once again sound more splashy. The bowls are a bit guitar shy for my tastes. There is less of a direct punch from bowls. The percussion almost drowns out the distant vocals. Tre Cool does have some pretty cool mini solos in the song.
Increased soundstage could result in all these changes. I don’t know, I’ve never heard a pair of headphones with soundstage, as you can see in my sig.

Third Movement “Dearly Beloved”
There is more punch from the toms. it would be a bit fatiguing to listen to the percussion for a long period of time. The guitar seems airy with more string and have less of an edge. the vocals are almost identical.

Brand New Colony by The Postal Service on “Give Up”
The wrench at the beginning sounds broader. The high “melody” is less pronounced while the focus seems to be on the beat. More detail around the spectrum is presented by the hd414 The vocals sound more underlying. Bowls make this song seem peppier. The bass notes are very lean. The percussion from the bowls seem to give a different impact than that of the hd414 pads.

Being For the Benefit of Mr. Kite by The Beatles on “Sgt. Pepper’s Lonely Hearts Club Band” Apple Lossless

I first notice the loss of bass. The organ sounds more whimsical and fun. The crash then muted cymbals have more of a presence. Punches and impacts are lost with the bowls. because of the nature of the recording, I couldn’t analyze the soundstage.


Conclusions
The bowls present more and better sounding percussion, soundstage, and airy-ness. The hd414 pads provide more detail, impact, bass, and guitar.


I am probably not the right person to do a comparison. In fact, I am probably the worst person because I have nothing to compare with. The changes I heard could be psychological and unrealistic. My views will conflict with those of fellow headfiers and I respect that, I hope you will too.
 
Aug 3, 2006 at 2:44 AM Post #3 of 22
I'd say your conclussions were pretty accurate.

The bowl pads do seem to have more air, soundstage, and perhaps detail - the leading edges of all notes seem to be a bit sharper, and the overall tones are brighter, and leaner. I suppose this is the effect of the chamber created by the bowl pads, which creates more of an airy sound, as the result of greater distance from the driver, and larger geometric volume, which permits/promotes greater velocity of the sound waves, with less interference.

The HD414 pads seem to have less air, less soundstage, and good detail - but, the leading edges of all notes seem less sharp, and the overall tones are less bright, and warmer and weighter. The highs are slightly less dominent, and the bass seems more solid. I suppose this is this results because the HD414 pads eliminate the air chamber and allow the driver to fit more closely to the ear, which seems to have the opposite effect, as the bowl pads do (i.e. no chamber, shorter distances, smaller geometric volume, interference with sound waves, etc.).

A compromise between the two is to reverse the bowl pads to allow the drivers to fit more closely to the ear, eliminating some of the chamber, which tends to reduce the brightness, and sharpness of the notes and tones, although slightly less than with the HD414 pads, because the bowl pads have no center, and still have a very small chamber. The sonic differences between the reverse bowl pads and the HD414 pads might be lesser, if you cut the centers out of the HD414 pads.

I prefer either the reverse bowl pads, or the HD414 pads for most of the music I listen to (e.g. jazz, R&B, country, chamber music, rock), I might prefer the bowl pads if I listened to more classical with full orchestras.

But... whatever you prefer, if you want the HD414's you can buy the HD414 pads directly from Sennheiser for $4.00 + shipping.

GF2
 
Aug 3, 2006 at 2:34 PM Post #4 of 22
Don't be sad. I've read them but did not reply with a post.
tongue.gif
I've tried both before and prefer the 414 for my MS1.

Actually, there is a review thread about these pads at the headphone reviews section.
 
Aug 30, 2006 at 10:33 PM Post #6 of 22
My HD414 Pad Mod:

I took some Plush Leather and glued it to the face of the Vwap pads (HD414) using RTV \ silicone glue. Basically a leather donut with the 4 slits.

This was before the Flat Pads were re-introduced.

They were a little more solid on my head and I felt they improved the sound- maybe it was from the pads compressing less and thus being a little further away from my ears?


Mitch
 
Aug 30, 2006 at 10:53 PM Post #8 of 22
Compared to the others I have had the chance to try (bowls and comfies) I find the reversed HD414 pads work best for me regarding both comfort and sound. I didn't see them mentioned above (unless I missed it).
 
Aug 30, 2006 at 11:22 PM Post #9 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by NiceCans
Compared to the others I have had the chance to try (bowls and comfies) I find the reversed HD414 pads work best for me regarding both comfort and sound. I didn't see them mentioned above (unless I missed it).


I haven't tried bowls yet, but compared to comfies, I can wear my reversed 414s on my MS-1s for at least ten hours with no discomfort.

That's comfort. And that ain't bad!!
smily_headphones1.gif
 
Aug 31, 2006 at 1:35 AM Post #10 of 22
for me, it depends on my cans. I really liked the 414's (w/ quarter-hole mod) on my Grado 125's. I now listen to HF-1's mostly and these are Way better with the bowls in normal position...for me anyways.
 
Sep 2, 2006 at 3:00 AM Post #11 of 22
a bit of a bump...

there is a world of difference between the hd414s and any grado pad for me. i tried all the different grado pads on at the boston meet bit none touched the hd414's. how do they sound different with the quarter hole mod? i've only got one pair of hd414 pads so i dont want to make em sound bad...
 
Sep 2, 2006 at 1:07 PM Post #13 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by mckickflip
how do they sound different with the quarter hole mod? i've only got one pair of hd414 pads so i dont want to make em sound bad...


I do not do the mod for sound, but cut them so as to be able to reverse them for comfort.
Reversed the HD414 pads are thicker, softer, and take on a sort-of-bowl shape that really helps keep them in place.
Oh, for shame! I have been untrue to the Head-Fi spirit as I have never done an A-B comparison for sound quality changes
plainface.gif


Quote:

Originally Posted by feh1325
i'm scared of getting any sharp close to my gear. i guess i'm a bit of a wuss when it comes to modding.


I do remove the pads from the headphones before cutting them
biggrin.gif
 
Sep 2, 2006 at 1:21 PM Post #14 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by NiceCans
I do not do the mod for sound, but cut them so as to be able to reverse them for comfort.
Reversed the HD414 pads are thicker, softer, and take on a sort-of-bowl shape that really helps keep them in place.
Oh, for shame! I have been untrue to the Head-Fi spirit as I have never done an A-B comparison for sound quality changes
plainface.gif



I do remove the pads from the headphones before cutting them
biggrin.gif



Please allow me to simply add my name to these statements! I agree wholeheartedly to each and every word of your comments....Exactly!!

...ok, my next phones will have bowls, so I'll give them a try, but these reversed 414s are the way to go for a comfortable ride! just great!
 
Sep 2, 2006 at 7:27 PM Post #15 of 22
Quote:

Originally Posted by NiceCans
I do remove the pads from the headphones before cutting them
biggrin.gif



And it's just to pull them of from the cups?
 

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