Schiit Loki Max Impressions
Dec 13, 2021 at 8:14 PM Post #16 of 266
I have a Freya + that I use almost exclusively in passive mode because I find the tube stage too warm in the mid base. Anyone have any experience using the 150hz band to address this? Been waiting for the Loki Max for, seems like, forever. I’m glad to have found this tread as finding any kind of first hand information difficult, until now.
 
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Dec 13, 2021 at 8:58 PM Post #17 of 266
Having had a Lokius in my system since it was released I will add my impressions as to the Loki Max.

Had Jason never finished his moonshot project I would have left Lokius in my system because just a little tweak can make things more enjoyable. First off, once you've done what's practical in your room for two channel stereo, guess what? It will still need some help! In this universe anyway. Just don't expect an EQ to correct everything.

My den is on the soft side, the vocals often too far back in the sound stage and just a little sparkle missing.

All it took was was a couple little tweaks.

What do you gain audibly in addition to the bells and whistles with the Loki Max?

An improved sound stage.

Here's my somewhat flawed use of words describing the difference I hear (please bear that in mind): The images are tighter and more solid in space. It's as if they would wander a bit with Lokius compared to LM. It's not easy to describe, but it's as if everything is more dynamic and emerges from a quieter space. A pleasant surprise!

On the headphone side of things my RAAL SR1a absolutely love the 20hz knob!

Lokius is good but LM is better. YMMV, you and your check book will decide.

My only niggle is it's a little tight sliding your index finger under the larger knobs if it's sitting beside your chair. Yeah I know it has a remote! :smile_phones:
IMG_20211209_154349065.jpg


Headphones: Roon-Yggy-Mj2-LM-Krell KAV-400xi.

Two channel: Roon-PS PerfectWave-PS BHK Pre-LM- Rotel RB-1590 amp -Revel Performa M126Be speakers.
love the red accent on the dials.
 
Dec 14, 2021 at 5:17 PM Post #18 of 266
Loki Max is Schiit's latest no-holds-barred EQ. Jason Stoddard describes it as "the world's only balanced, full L-C, remote controlled EQ with memory presets" or words to that effect.

Here it is in my system:
IMG_1378.jpg

After finally getting time for some extended listening with the Loki Max in my office system, I have a few quick impressions to share.

First off, for those worried that "adding a component" to your system would somehow change or compromise the sound quality, in my system the Loki Max was completely transparent. I have it connected via balanced ICs between my Yggdrasil and my amp. With all bands set to zero, I used the bypass function to test if sending the signal through the electronics changed it in some way, I heard everything as clear and perfect in bypass as with the controls in. It was undetectably transparent.

Physically the thing is surprisingly heavy. I know this is due to all the inductors and the power supply, but it feels like a brick especially for its size. Also because of all the inductors and transformer (i.e. heavy metal) inside, the device runs warm. Not hot, certainly not too hot to touch, but much warmer than I expected. Warmer than the Yggdrasil beneath it in my setup.

The adjustments are subtle in a very welcome way unless you crank them to the maximums and then they approach too much. I found the the effects in all bands at three to five clicks cut or two to three clicks boost were perfect and very pleasing to me. I was able to significantly improve the Voce headphones (to my tastes) with some small boosts in the low end and small cuts on the high end. The Infinity RSII loudspeakers required a different set of cuts and boosts, so I was very happy to have three memory presets available. One for flat, two for speakers, three for headphones. Nice.

For those who may be used to a continuous EQ or tone controls, using one that switches relays through stepped adjustments takes some getting used to. While the motorized faders are moving, the adjustment is not audible until it stops. So for example, the Max comes with a factory preset of all-flat in preset one giving you a nice default starting point (the faders have no detent at zero, making a return to zero without looking difficult.) So, if I am testing a setup and wish to return to flat, I press the preset one button on the very nice remote control and the knobs start spinning. I hear no changes while the knobs rotate until they stop. I am used to a continuous EQ which would let me hear the sweep. A minor thing, but for oldies like me who have experience in studios or with live sound mixing, it's different.

Sound wise I return to the transparent comment I made earlier. This is what you pay for in a machine like this, and why in my opinion the Loki Max is an absolute bargain. Because of the stepped attenuators and the massive power supply and the true L-C envelope filters and attention to engineering details, the noise floor is not detectable. I haven't scoped it but I think the ratings given on the Schiit website are conservative. And it may be the placebo effect because I am not immune to that (like all humans) but I believe the overall presentation (sound stage) and sound quality of my system has improved, even with the settings to flat, and especially when I power up the loudspeakers in my office and listen through air. Something has changed, it is more than subtle, and I like it.

I am still listening and liking what I hear. Nice work, Schiit.

Schiit product page: https://www.schiit.com/products/loki-max
Can you comment on the speed of the pots when using the remote? The volume on the Freya is hard to keep from overshooting due to how fast it operates, for instance. I find myself adjusting up and down several times before I can set the level I want.
 
Dec 15, 2021 at 10:43 AM Post #19 of 266
Dec 15, 2021 at 1:43 PM Post #20 of 266
It is not too fast to control, and a single press on the remote moves the control one click.

Here's a short video: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tIEZbqIWKGiKQ5pFu_-jDQ_s3NZ4oNo7/view?usp=sharing
Ok, I’ve been sitting on the fence too long. I’m putting in my order. I’ve been fretting over this product for almost 2 years now. First with when it will become available and then if it’s performance justifies it’s price. Time to close my eyes and jump in the deep end.
 
Dec 15, 2021 at 8:52 PM Post #23 of 266
Has anyone experimented with placing the Loki before or after the Freya?

My system is Yggdrasil -> Loki Max -> Freya+ -> Yamaha B2 -> Yamaha NS1000M.

I know the Yggy and Freya are fully balanced, whereas the Loki converts to single ended and back to balanced. I wonder if there is an advantage to placing the Loki after the Freya so everything stays fully balanced until it arrives at the Loki.
 
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Dec 16, 2021 at 7:55 AM Post #26 of 266
Has anyone experimented with placing the Loki before or after the Freya?

My system is Yggdrasil -> Loki Max -> Freya+ -> Yamaha B2 -> Yamaha NS1000M.

I know the Yggy and Freya are fully balanced, whereas the Loki converts to single ended and back to balanced. I wonder if there is an advantage to placing the Loki after the Freya so everything stays fully balanced until it arrives at the Loki.
Schiit says noise is slightly lower with the Max before the preamp but I am planning to use mine after. I want to try and neutralize some of of the mid bass warmth of the Freyas tube stage.
 
Dec 16, 2021 at 11:31 AM Post #27 of 266
Has anyone experimented with placing the Loki before or after the Freya?

My system is Yggdrasil -> Loki Max -> Freya+ -> Yamaha B2 -> Yamaha NS1000M.

I know the Yggy and Freya are fully balanced, whereas the Loki converts to single ended and back to balanced. I wonder if there is an advantage to placing the Loki after the Freya so everything stays fully balanced until it arrives at the Loki.
Interesting...I hadn't thought about that. My preamp already converts balanced to SE, as it accepts balanced XLR inputs, but only has SE out. If I added a Loki Max, I wonder how detrimental (if at all) an additional balanced-SE-balanced conversion in the chain might be? Yggdrasil (balanced out) -> Loki (balanced in-converts to SE-converts back to balanced out) -> preamp (balanced in-converts to SE). Worth trying still, or problematic out of the gate?
 
Dec 16, 2021 at 11:52 AM Post #28 of 266
As a general comment, in my experience - unless you are using really sub-par equipment - signal chain changes such as described above do not impact the quality of the net result. The only thing they might do is introduce noise, and the Loki Max is not noisy.
 
Dec 16, 2021 at 11:53 AM Post #29 of 266
Interesting...I hadn't thought about that. My preamp already converts balanced to SE, as it accepts balanced XLR inputs, but only has SE out. If I added a Loki Max, I wonder how detrimental (if at all) an additional balanced-SE-balanced conversion in the chain might be? Yggdrasil (balanced out) -> Loki (balanced in-converts to SE-converts back to balanced out) -> preamp (balanced in-converts to SE). Worth trying still, or problematic out of the gate?
As Loki uses a differential buffer and your preamp uses very fine Cinemag transformers, you'll be fine.
 
Dec 17, 2021 at 5:06 PM Post #30 of 266
I’ve grown to like the Loki Max more and more over the past week. At first, I wasn’t sure I’d use the equalizer regularly, but now it’s in regular use. I have one setting for my LCD-5 and one setting for my HE-1000SE, with the third preset reserved for baseline. When I’m not using the EQ, I have the pass-through function engaged. I don’t detect any additional noise from using either mode.

With the HE-1000SE, I have the last three knobs turned to 10 o’clock. That adjustment is very useful for all of the poorly-recorded music (read: pop and rock with treble that’s a bit hot) that I have in my collection. It smooths over any treble peaks nicely. With regards to classical music, I’ve used the last two knobs at 10 o’clock to take the edge off the Dunedin Consort recording I have of Mozart’s Requiem on which the sopranos are a bit too in-your-face.

With the LCD-5, I have the first two knobs turned to 2-3 o’clock to give the headphone a boost of warmth with pop and rock and a bit more bass thump when listening to EDM and electronic music. It doesn’t fundamentally change the character of that headphone from its reference-tuned defaults, but it does make the LCD-5 more listener-friendly in those cases.

Other people on this thread have commented on losing resolution when using the Loki Max. I’ve tuned my system to a very resolving baseline. Whatever tiny bit of definition I lose when making tuning adjustments with the equalizer is barely noticeable. Really, I’m willing to sacrifice a few 0s and 1s to make the music I listen to more enjoyable. Isn’t that the point of an equalizer?

As I’ve commented before, having 8 knobs versus 6 for greater granularity would be nice, but this is a very solid and enjoyable Schiit product. I’m definitely keeping mine.
 

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