[dunring]

If you want to laugh and be terrified at the same time, I found this thread while perusing Audiogon about power cables. How much you know about cables is directly proportional to how much you spend on cables. I'm related to Samuel Clemens, my favorite quote of his applies to audio hardware:

"It's easier to fool someone than it is to convince them that they've been fooled".
-Mark Twain

 

[Dankeschön]

I believe this thread is not about cable debate.

Its about what's the best USB cable for the money.

For some it may be Amazon budget, for others it's something else.

Maybe not jump on the "Amazon usb is all you need"... Some people are on a budget, and some people don't believe in cables. Accept that.

 

[fidgeraldo]

I'm related to Samuel Clemens, my favorite quote of his applies to audio hardware:

I also heard that the biggest believers are actually non-believers. They so much believe in that that there isn't anything that believers believe that actually makes them bigger believers than actual believers who believe that there is something...

Why would you even bother about what others believe? Why is there a drive in you to force you to make a statement?

Lonely?
Funny thing...right?

In which group do you fit?

Plus, Mark Twain was a very talented and intelligent individual, so it's a shame and waste to quote his greatness on such innocent life things. There are much better ways to use Twain's legacy.

Mirror, mirror on the wall, who is the most beautiful of all...tell us what you see?

Cheers!

 

[TheR0v3r]

i’ve been recently building up a quite nice desktop system. i plan to use my laptop as the source. and maybe that will be a mistake instead of going for a dedicated streamer.

so from what i gathered in light of others experiences here, i’ll probably go for one of the two options which are miles apart with their price points :

1) intona reference
2) supra 2.0

my question is rather simple. my laptop doesn't have usbA type ports but usbC. in order to use these cables i have to add an adapter. theres ifi isilencer, and there are tiny generic adapters you find on amazon. which one would better suit not taking away from the gains ?

I have both, recommend both but the best use case is very different. If your sending a good ”cleaned” signal to the dac i highly recommend the Intona, otherwise the Supra 2.0.

 

[TheR0v3r]

i have a mola mola dac and decided to order intona reference usb cable to feed it.

to converting usbA to C though, instead of choosing something like isilencer, i could go for igalvanic3.0 with an additional usbAtoB cable upstream converted with a small amazon adapter.

mola mola’s usb receiver should be a decent one. so, idk whether igalvanize would be an overkill with additional circuits/cables/adapters ? sometimes doing too much is can be unproductive…

any opinions ?

That’s a very nice DAC - congrats!

I’ve used almost ”all” kind of gizmos to clean the USB signal and many times it has ended up sounding… filtered. Sometimes doing more is doing too much! The Intona is a very, very ”correct” cable which is both a good and a bad thing. The good thing is that it’ll transfer a clean signal intact but the bad thing is that it will also transfer a bad signal intact.

Many other cables are not as technically correct because there are reflections (impedance variations), shielding issues etc that combine to effect the signal. And this can be a positive! My suggestion would be to have the Oyaide and Supra along with the Intona. Experiment and see what fits.

 

[TheR0v3r]

I also heard that the biggest believers are actually non-believers. They so much believe in that that there isn't anything that believers believe that actually makes them bigger believers than actual believers who believe that there is something...

Why would you even bother about what others believe? Why is there a drive in you to force you to make a statement?

Lonely?
Funny thing...right?

In which group do you fit?

Plus, Mark Twain was a very talented and intelligent individual, so it's a shame and waste to quote his greatness on such innocent life things. There are much better ways to use Twain's legacy.

Mirror, mirror on the wall, who is the most beautiful of all...tell us what you see?

Cheers!

This is a most excellent post, wish I could upvote more than once.

 

[TheR0v3r]

Just wanted to add, I was skeptical about a USB cable making any sound difference but I decided to replace my generic $10 streamer to DAC USB with a Neotech 1020, and wow I was surprised at the difference. There was an immediate increase in note weight and darker background. I actually had to turn down the volume a little from where I normally run it on my Holo Bliss (digital numbers so I know exactly what it was). Other changes are more subtle so I don’t know for sure, but it seems like more details and clarity with the darker background.

I’m happily surprised.

BTW, that Neotech USB cable is probably an exceptional fit with your most excellent DAC. It’s a difficult cable to use in a system ’cause it needs a very good USB implementation to sound right (which your DAC has) otherwise it ends up sounding harsh. Owned that cable when I had my Chord setup(s) but never got it to work…

 

[phoneslave86]

Anyone tried audio envy Newton? It might beat the neotech if one wanted to risk being a bit of an experiment. This looks like an enticing USB at the price. Looks to combine real OCC copper with some noise separation. Might even possibly be able to get the power end deleted. This is similiar to Sablon 2020 which you can have with or without the USB power which causes the noise issues. Some DACs and streamers might not work with it like that though so have to find out.

 

[dougms3]

BTW, that Neotech USB cable is probably an exceptional fit with your most excellent DAC. It’s a difficult cable to use in a system ’cause it needs a very good USB implementation to sound right (which your DAC has) otherwise it ends up sounding harsh. Owned that cable when I had my Chord setup(s) but never got it to work…

Neotech wiring is always a good option for everything.

They're one of the handful of companies that actually have license to produce occ copper wire from dr. Ohno.

They probably supply allot of the market since they have the best prices.

 

[37mil]

I have perhaps a naive question, I am also looking for a good quality USB cable for my system.
This is not a “bits are bits” question but I would seriously like to understand the physics involved.

I accept that all these various USB cables sound different, e.g. better soundstage, deeper bass, more detailed midrange, etc. As an example, if cable A has a better midrange than cable B; as the data 1’s and 0’s travel through the cable (as an analog signal of course) how does the cable discriminate particular bits that represent say a 1/44,000 of a midrange signal from all the other bits so it can be treated differently?

It seems to me that if a particular cable attenuates a signal in some way, all the bits in the signal would be similarly effected, unless the cable “knew” that certain bits would become a part of a low frequency sound or a high frequency sound. But as all the bits are streaming at the same rate, and each one represents a minute fraction of a complex (e.g. full orchestral work) waveform, how does this effect happen?

Thanks for any clarification on this.

Your concept of this is incorrect. The change of sound by the cable does not come from a change in data received. Although usb audio is asynchronous meaning that any incorrect or distorted data that makes it to the receiving dac cannot be corrected, the mechanism for digital data transmission is so robust that 99.999% of the time there are zero errors. Zero. Any significant errors will clearly be audible as a loud crack or dropout.

The change in sound is due to the transfer function of all the electronic components that are connected upstream, PSUs, all EMI, RFI, cable insulator dielectric effects, and other factors which all affect the electrical ground between all components towards the DAC. As it reaches the DAC, the ground in the DAC becomes affected by this electrical connection and subsequently because the analog audio signal is produced from the ground reference, the output will become altered. This is why the cable has a signature or character. It's digital data independent. It's also why if you try enough usb cables you'll notice that some sound louder than others.

When it comes to hi-fi, the quality of the power is the most important thing to get right because that is the basic building block of the audio signal that is produced. Unfortunately, the nature of electricity means that the system of components that are needed are ultimately tied together polluting each other.

 

[Dankeschön]

Off topic, sorry.. Can someone link me to a cable fit for Sennheiser 560s if 4.4 pentaconn in the end its a plus.

Sennheiser has a twist lock at the receiver side/headphone and only one connector at the headphone.

560s is a bit newish, I believe more models has the same connector, but I'm not 100% sure.

 

[mbirand]

When it comes to hi-fi, the quality of the power is the most important thing to get right because that is the basic building block of the audio signal that is produced. Unfortunately, the nature of electricity means that the system of components that are needed are ultimately tied together polluting each other.

this is one subject i’d like to understand and make wiser decisions. everything else in the chain has been simpler to choose from but power chords and distributors/conditioners are not that easy. i’ve read also that you might easily overdo here and have a worse outcome…

this post has started to be exactly that for me only to end up being a teaser on the subject.

jokes aside, where would i find proper, trustworthy, information to educate myself on the subject of “power” (as a noob in the hobby with no tech background). i’m scared to make wrong decisions going by reviews cuz theres mostly some bias there.

 

[fidgeraldo]

jokes aside, where would i find proper, trustworthy, information to educate myself on the subject of “power” (as a noob in the hobby with no tech background). i’m scared to make wrong decisions going by reviews cuz theres mostly some bias there.

I stopped looking and settled with Supra...I think it's a safe bet if you don't or won't dig any further unless you like digging.

Cheers!

 

[phoneslave86]

this is one subject i’d like to understand and make wiser decisions. everything else in the chain has been simpler to choose from but power chords and distributors/conditioners are not that easy. i’ve read also that you might easily overdo here and have a worse outcome…

this post has started to be exactly that for me only to end up being a teaser on the subject.

jokes aside, where would i find proper, trustworthy, information to educate myself on the subject of “power” (as a noob in the hobby with no tech background). i’m scared to make wrong decisions going by reviews cuz theres mostly some bias there.

Get a $100-$200 emi tester to start. Just figuring out how bad the power is the first step. Some circuits are shared and worse, you be fine or could move to a more quiet circuit thats good enough too.

Listen morning noon and night and early hours and test for a week or two when you can. Eventually you’ll have an idea of things than can decide what to do. Often there is a much better outlet in the same room. The difference between the worst outlets and best could be an epic level upgrade just moving equipment. Be aware of large stuff like gaming pc on same circuit of audio system.

Best thing for bad power cost wise is a dedicated line probably if you can’t fix it. Cheap and effective stuff is fixing loose connections, look for flickering lights when stuff is turned on and off. Cleaning all connections in entire home and audio system with deoxit red/gold plus tightening connections could be a big upgrade. Replacing old panel ($180 and tightening panel) can be big.

Most power conditioners kill dynamics, save up get puritan PSM with an ultimate cable and a ground master it sounds like a clean outlet, it also can help vs dc line noise. Or do the above and try a powerblock (outlets in a box) just need a big high flow cable for a power block. I’m going to try an audio envy okta (audio grade block, with a breaker to protect from lightening) plus a dedicated 20A line soon. This is less cost than one PSM156 and probably as good or better. One cant always get a dedicated line but if you need one and can get 2-3 years out of it I think it’s likely worth the money

 

[iFi audio]

this is one subject i’d like to understand and make wiser decisions. everything else in the chain has been simpler to choose from but power chords and distributors/conditioners are not that easy. i’ve read also that you might easily overdo here and have a worse outcome…

this post has started to be exactly that for me only to end up being a teaser on the subject.

jokes aside, where would i find proper, trustworthy, information to educate myself on the subject of “power” (as a noob in the hobby with no tech background). i’m scared to make wrong decisions going by reviews cuz theres mostly some bias there.

This is a subject of much debate unless you are one of those that have heard what the benefit of a "better" PS can bring to your listening.

Here is what I suggest, most folks will say a linear power supply can make a big difference, take a look on Amazon for one that suits your needs voltage-wise, and get it! If you don't perceive a difference after two weeks return it! Then order one of our power supplies say an iPower X and listen to your gear again, see if it makes a difference, if not you know what to do!

Always put your opinion first and foremost! But always try things because that is the best way!

Cheers!!