Enter the Dragon / ATH-W2002 mini-review
Dec 14, 2001 at 11:17 PM Thread Starter Post #1 of 19

M Rael

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I heard someplace that there are 2 kinds of knowledge: theres knowing what we know, and theres knowing what we dont know. But theres something missing from that. And its this: we dont know, what we dont know.
I had to start with that, because earlier headphones I've owned and earlier comments I've made about them seem queer to me now. For example if I said in the past that the Sony F1 sounded ok to me, or that it was neutral in areas that the Grado 325 was not; that was fine before now. And I've owned the K1000 and the CD3000 and they both have good qualities. But lately I've come to see those earlier comments were a case of 'not knowing what I dont know.'


Enter the Dragon / Audio-Technica ATH-W2002:

Its been less than a week, but some ideas have formed already about their sound. And I'm guessing the sound will change over time; after all these have barely over 10 hours on them. I listen to CD, either through a Sony X707ES or my portable player with the Apheared 'caffeine' amp. As a rule I always listen to recordings flat, i.e. with no equalizing or DSP thrown in.

The W2002 is extremely clear sounding. Clear and open.
The Sex Pistols, on the other hand, are very dirty sounding. Dirty and spotty. I will try to explain therefore, that the W2002 does not make certain kinds of music sound better than they are or than they were recorded. It is instead a work of craftsmanship and technology that you place on your head, and it lets you absorb whatever it is that went into the recording. For good or for bad.
I'm going to disdain acting as if the program material itself is 'calling the shots' in my listening impressions, and so I'm not going to quote specific program material as examples. The W2002's sound balanced and flat across the frequencies. Thats all I expected and hoped from them. I dont expect the same clairity and balance in the recordings I own as I do from my headphones; thats sad but true. The width and depth of the sonic events (music) while listening to the W2002's and the separation of individual instruments, is in every way facilitated by them, if the recording contains such information and if the rest of your system has the resolution for it. I dont sense imbalances when I have these headphones on. Even though some CD's are bright or some CD's dont have lots of bass, thats ok with me now. When a CD does have bass, I have heard it in a new and wonderful way:
low frequency events seem to extend outward from the headphone and indeed from the head itself. It was an odd feeling at first, since the Grado I own seemed to be such a bass happy specimen, but I'm thinking now that the Grado is merely 'humped' and warm at a certain lower frequency. The lowest frequencies from the W2002 are distinctly non-directional, and seem to move equally away from the ear as towards it. It has the effect of an actual low frequency event, rather than a blast of warm air from a speaker into your ear.

No comparison.
Say, its a lot of work writing all this stuff up! And by now I'm trying to make my escape stage left. I know I didnt touch on the midrange or treble, but I have something to say in closing thats actually very funny to me, from my point of view: back when we were talking about the Sony F1 I said that there were better choices for the beginning buyer, and that I would never recommend them to someone as a first headphone, or for any other reason other than to just try them, and even then they were not worth full retail at $299. Whats funny to me is this: I'm nervous about suggesting a stranger spend $180 on the F1, but I would recommend the $725+ Audio-Technica ATH-W2002 to anyone who is serious about headphone listening and who has that kind of money to spend. On that point I have a clear conscience. Recording quality may vary greatly from one to the next, but I feel the W2002's excellence is a sure thing. I used to think the F1 was fine and the 325 sounded good, but I didnt know, what I didnt know.


Short version of the review for those with ADD:

Mark likes them, and says they are well worth the money.
 
Dec 14, 2001 at 11:30 PM Post #2 of 19
Hmmm...interesting...I want some of your drugs.
biggrin.gif
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 12:02 AM Post #5 of 19
Quote:

Originally posted by M Rael
I heard someplace that there are 2 kinds of knowledge: theres knowing what we know, and theres knowing what we dont know. But theres someting missing from that. And its this: we dont know, what we dont know. [...]


/Geek Rant Warning

Indeed, the fact that we do not know and - even worse, have no way of knowing - what we don't know is a key issue in decision making, learning, information retrieval, etc. The fact that we cannot even know what questions to ask to reduce our ignorance is called the "anomalous state of knowledge" a key concept in certain areas of psychology, management, and computer science. With your thinking you find yourself in great company.



/ Geek Rant End
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 12:10 AM Post #6 of 19
Quote:

Originally posted by acidtripwow
Hmmm...interesting...I want some of your drugs.
biggrin.gif


I see: a guy who calls himself 'acid-trip-wow' wants some of my drugs. Is this the way you start all your conversations? Ahh, you were probably refering to the phrase 'not knowing, what you dont know.' Yeah, its a handfull, but keep trying. If worse comes to worse, just fake it.
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 12:32 AM Post #7 of 19
I do too know what I don't know, or at least I did a minute ago...
Wait a minute, better take another Ritalin...

I know nothing of these headphones. Are they open, closed, or somewhere in between? I have already concluded that they do not fall in the canal phone category.

These may be the zen-phones that I have been searching for.
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 12:43 AM Post #8 of 19
Quote:

Originally posted by M Rael
I see: a guy who calls himself 'acid-trip-wow' wants some of my drugs. Is this the way you start all your conversations? Ahh, you were probably refering to the phrase 'not knowing, what you dont know.' Yeah, its a handfull, but keep trying. If worse comes to worse, just fake it.


.........I can't tell if you're joking, or if you're really trying to insult him. clarification, please?
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 12:47 AM Post #9 of 19
insult
ooooooooooooooohhhh
but he's the king so he can do that. I want a ATH-W2002
Regardless of sound quality, that 'phone is tight!
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 1:19 AM Post #11 of 19
I'm not trying to insult anyone (including you, Neruda.) I dont know why that fellow calls himself acidtripwow, but he's always been fun to read, in my book. I was just (gently) teasing him about his alias.

Greg Freeman, yes my good man: these phones are they. These are the zen phones you have been looking for. If you hear Shakuhachi playing through them you will naturally and effortlessly assume a position of exceeding physical stillness, and your mind will inhabit the threshold samadhi (but you will have spent $750.) If you actually thinking of taking the next small step toward getting them, lets exchange some PM's and I'll tell you how to go about it. The enclosures seal out a fair amount of sound; more than the CD3000 for example. They arent 'sealed' in the sense that you're totally deaf to the outside world.
I cant tell you much about the driver itself; the Audio-Technica website can, but they tell you in Japanese. I'm working on that problem locally with someone. I hope to have a translation at some point.



 
Dec 15, 2001 at 6:34 AM Post #12 of 19
I think acidtrip was referring to your phones.
wink.gif
 
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Dec 15, 2001 at 4:27 PM Post #14 of 19
Quote:

If you hear Shakuhachi playing through them you will naturally and effortlessly assume a position of exceeding physical stillness


M Rael,
I guess you are aware that your review has quite the opposite effect.
biggrin.gif


I am very glad to hear that they sound just as great as they look. Congratulations!
 
Dec 15, 2001 at 8:21 PM Post #15 of 19
Quote:

Indeed, the fact that we do not know and - even worse, have no way of knowing - what we don't know


Oh sheeeit, don't get me started. I just finished two philosophy papers and i'm about to start another one (procrastinating as usual). Aaaaanyways, as a breif non-refutation, your statement is either false or is saying nothing. If what you are saying is that we cannot identify what we do not know, this is false (for example, i don't know what consciousness is- QED). If what you're saying is that what do not know, we do not know, then it's obvious that you're just repeating yourself. so there.

once again, i apologize profusely, but finals week is slowly turning me into even more of a disfunctional human being.
 

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