[Mikesin]

Hello

I have a pair of AKG K702's and powering them using my FiiO E7 & E9, im now thinking about upgrading the amp, wanting more! 
How's the FiiO E9 Vs Matrix M-Stage, would you say there is a huge difference between the two? I've also heard about the 'Lovely Cube' and 'Matrix Cube', how's are those?

I need to also know if the setup will be able to switch between speakers and headphones with the matrix like my E9 can? (Speakers are plugged into the rear of the E9's 'PRE_OUTPUT', I simply take out the headphones when I want to use the speakers)
 
The budget is around the same price of the M-Stage!

Thanks

 

[pp312]

I've never heard the fiio duo, I own a matrix M-stage, but I would suggest that there will never be a "huge difference" between similarly priced amps, or even between very differently priced amps. Huge differences belong in the realm of headphones, not amps, and anything that drives your phones without being under duress and is not highly coloured (few decent amps are) will provide more than satisfactory results. As well as the Matrix I own a $150 Muse amp and, while the matrix is slightly more neutral, the differences are really quite insignificant.

 

[Mikesin]

So the differences you would think are not very significant? Could anyone else put some input in?

 

[pp312]

Others willl probably input, but be wary of hyperbole.

 

[Yoga]

I've compared the M-Stage and E9, using both LCD-2s and HD650s.
 
I very much doubt I could have identified them in a blind A/B test. Both very capable amps :¬)

 

[Mikesin]

I guess the E9 is very good then for its price , looks like theres no need to upgrade (If you would say it was an upgrade..).
 
Quote:

I've compared the M-Stage and E9, using both LCD-2s and HD650s.
 
I very much doubt I could have identified them in a blind A/B test. Both very capable amps :¬)

 

 

[VALIENTE]

I suggest that you save pennies for a better amp and dac for K702. Maybe you may go for Schit Lyr and Dacmagic.

You may notice improvement.

 

[MalVeauX]

Heya,
 
On those headphones, you'll notice more likely from a change in source & DAC, not amplification.
 
Very best,

 

[Chris_Himself]

The M-Stage is awesome. It's built with brand name internals and everything inside screams quality! I'm not entirely sure if anything else can beat it for the price except for Audio Gd stuff

 

[Mikesin]

How does the Matrix Cube compare with the FiiO Combo & M-Stage then? The Cube's price range isn't far from the M-Stage
Quote:

Heya,
 
On those headphones, you'll notice more likely from a change in source & DAC, not amplification.
 
Very best,

 
Have you ever tried the FiiO E9 though? People seem to underestimate this item due to the price..


Quote:

The M-Stage is awesome. It's built with brand name internals and everything inside screams quality! I'm not entirely sure if anything else can beat it for the price except for Audio Gd stuff

 
-
 
 
Also, If I was to purchase this amp, I would also get the Class A Bias Modded OPamp if that makes any difference?

 

[Chris_Himself]

Quote:

How does the Matrix Cube compare with the FiiO Combo & M-Stage then? The Cube's price range isn't far from the M-Stage


 
Have you ever tried the FiiO E9 though? People seem to underestimate this item due to the price..


 
-
 
 
Also, If I was to purchase this amp, I would also get the Class A Bias Modded OPamp if that makes any difference?

 

Yep definitely get the upgrade. It's the cheapest way to alter one's tone to your liking! Better OPamps either produce a cleaner sound at the given power or a warmer sound depending if you want a more analog sound. Burr Brown OPA opamps are in the latter category IMO.
 
I've yet to find an amp around this size and price that can do it. Even at twice the price it'd be pretty hard. RSA definitely comes to mind though since Dale Vishay film caps are pretty expensive along with those custom 24k gold plated jacks.
 
Consider buying a Mini-i and M-Stage. The M-Stage is a great amp and can upstage a lot of stuff, but not if it's fed poo. The E7 is already pretty good though. It's using a Wolfson WM8740 DAC even though with limited buffering, it sounds pretty good. The better DAC's out there use the WM8741 which makes an audible difference but since you already own an E7, I'd think you're already running a pretty good, solid signal to feed any potential amps you have in your sights.
 
Sell the E9, grab the M-Stage. If you can find one used on the classifieds, ask if you can give it back if you're not happy with it, those things sell like hotcakes anyway and there are some really nice and generous people on the boards.
​

 

 

[Mikesin]

Thanks, what would you say was a better DAC according to the spec's of my FiiO E7 and Asus Xonar DS with a opamp LM4562NA, i think it has a 'Wolfson WM8776' ?? And is the DAC of the Xonar Essence ST/X any good? I could pair that with my FiiO E9 (if that amp is actually better)??

What was you refering to about the upgrade, the opamp mod or the Matrix Cube?  
 
Quote:

 

Yep definitely get the upgrade. It's the cheapest way to alter one's tone to your liking! Better OPamps either produce a cleaner sound at the given power or a warmer sound depending if you want a more analog sound. Burr Brown OPA opamps are in the latter category IMO.
 
I've yet to find an amp around this size and price that can do it. Even at twice the price it'd be pretty hard. RSA definitely comes to mind though since Dale Vishay film caps are pretty expensive along with those custom 24k gold plated jacks.
 
Consider buying a Mini-i and M-Stage. The M-Stage is a great amp and can upstage a lot of stuff, but not if it's fed poo. The E7 is already pretty good though. It's using a Wolfson WM8740 DAC even though with limited buffering, it sounds pretty good. The better DAC's out there use the WM8741 which makes an audible difference but since you already own an E7, I'd think you're already running a pretty good, solid signal to feed any potential amps you have in your sights.
 
Sell the E9, grab the M-Stage. If you can find one used on the classifieds, ask if you can give it back if you're not happy with it, those things sell like hotcakes anyway and there are some really nice and generous people on the boards.
​

 

 

 

[Chris_Himself]

The E7 is the better DAC definitely, the Asus Xonar DS upgraded with LM4562NA (same thing I'm using) is the better amp, power wise. The WM8776 is mostly a surround sound CODEC, and not a stereo DAC. Both are of relatively high quality, former being better. The only step up from there is the Wolfson 8741 which is used on the high end DAC's and integrated setups. I'm aware of some higher end ones like the Sabre 32-bit and others but for the most part, music is in 16-bit/44.1 anyway unless I'm either wrong or you listen to higher quality music than that.
 
The Essence ST/X series use the Wolfson 8740 DAC (same as E7), but DAC's are just about who's using what 20-60 dollar DAC chip, it's all about implementation and components and the ST/X uses higher quality copper traces and the card is allegedly EMI shielded from computer noise. For 200 dollars it's still very expensive and you can get the same package from a nice portable DAC/amp. For instance the E7/E9 combo would be better, iBasso D4 w/ rollable opamp would be about the same as well if you don't feel like carrying two things around.
 
The LM4562 when implemented according to spec can drive 600ohm loads quite easily according to their spec. Considering this is a semiconductor company and this stuff is used in engineering samples and stuff, they can't exaggerate and most things are underrated to be safe.
 
For the money though, I think a desktop dacamp (I'm going to start a trend of making one word) usually promises better returns, but they're large, require being plugged in, and the entry point is slightly higher.
 
The X-Fi Titanium w/ LM4562 plus the nichicon 2200uf power filter cap I'm running is pretty silent. I know there are better DAC chips than the ancient Cirrus Logic I'm using, but for the most part I'm getting a very clean signal with a very low noise floor. I don't run excessively hard loads on it, nor did I bother upgrading the OPamps for the other channels, but it's a pretty solid setup rivaling some more expensive desktop units. The DACMagic I compared it to had a better DAC section for sure, but the amp section is lacking (then again thats not it's primary purpose) so 20 dollars worth of parts and tools ended up being quite worth the trouble?
 
I'm also the owner of an iBasso D3, it's actually a pretty strong little portable amp, and it's pretty as hell and it's held up quite a bit over the years, but power wise, it's not going to be able to drive crazy loads like the M-Stage can. We shouldn't even be discussing portable setups haha.
 
Did you know that you can get LM4562's for free as a sample? PM me if you need help doing that. 
 
I'm friends with someone who owns the Mini-i and M-stage combo. For him to be any happier (we've been doing some shopping), he'd have to grab a Burson 160D, Grace M902, or some other $1200+ setup. This isn't including the tube preamps that he's been so keen on these days.