flinkenick's 17 Flagship IEM Shootout Thread (and general high-end portable audio discussion)
Jun 3, 2018 at 2:24 PM Post #10,246 of 39,419
Thanks for the feedback Collin!

Well, I don't want to sound like I'm being too harsh on the Zombie.

By way of explanation, the review unit arrived with only a 3.5mm single-ended cable. The only compatible balanced cable I had was being used to burn in my R1.

I actually messaged Sammy from Rhapsodio on here (Head-Fi PM), and also directly on the Rhapsodio website.
I was asking if he could supply a balanced cable for the review tour. Also a separate enquiry about a cable I'd seen on their website that I was interested in purchasing.

That was last week and I've still heard nothing. I was initially quite unimpressed, since this is my first time to encounter Rhapsodio and I seem to recall hearing good things about them and Sammy. However, I was invited onto the tour by a 3rd party, not Sammy, so I had little frame of reference.

So I was pretty disappointed by what seemed like a disturbing lack of customer service, and with regards to a TOTL product no less.
And with only a single-ended cable, I wasn't really able to use the most suitable gear to do justice to the Zombie's pretty unique signature.
Finally some sudden health/personal problems compounded it all for me, and having only just finished reviewing the Mason v3, I decided to send the Zombie straight on and give it a miss.

Since I didn't know what was going on with Sammy, I didn't want to flame him or the company on the threads here for lack of responsiveness without first knowing whether there were any extenuating circumstances (and I'm certainly not flaming them now, just trying to explain my less-than overly positive initial impressions).
Similarly, I didn't want to write a what probably would have been a very critical review without having had the chance to show the IEM's at their best through the right choice of AMP units on my DX200, cables and whatnot.

I suspect if I could whack a balanced EA Thor II silver cable on it and play it on AMP1 or AMP3 (DX200), I'd probably like it a whole lot more :D
Oh, and the Dita Dream had caught my eye before, although I've yet to hear it. Will give it a try maybe at CanJam London if possible :)
Personally, I don't think the balance cable is going to give you the night and day difference in listening experience that you feel it's going to, but that is only my opinion. I think that the Dita Dream is some of the best bass I've ever heard, that being said I have three of the best bass IEM's available at the moment, 2 DD and 1 Ba, so I will comment regarding those later.
 
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Jun 3, 2018 at 3:25 PM Post #10,247 of 39,419
Personally, I don't think the balance cable is going to give you the night and day difference in listening experience that you feel it's going to

Just to explain, it's not that I was expecting the cable itself to make a huge difference. Simply that I was only supplied with a single ended 3.5mm cable, and was using the DX200 with the default AMP1, and with hybrid IEM's with reasonably complex crossovers that are generally regarded as benefitting from a more powerful amp section.

As far as I recall, the balanced section on the AMP1 was generally considered to be significantly better than the single ended one (it has both).
Accordingly, the Zombie did not sound great in the single-ended port of AMP1.
However, it improved significantly when plugged into AMP5 :)

And with the Zombie being (to my ears) rather warm and lush, I would have wanted to try them with something more neutral/reference than AMP5.
Hence why the cable would have made a difference, although not necessarily due any innate superpowers it might otherwise possess :)
It's not the Horus, after all :wink:
 
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Jun 3, 2018 at 3:38 PM Post #10,248 of 39,419
I should remind you that the Soundwriter is a collaboration with 64Audio; not EE. But, I can confirm what Nic's saying: There will be a shift in the SW's campaign, but it's all for the best and I can't wait until Project K unveils their flagship in its final form. :wink:

I'm well aware it is a collab w/64, I want clear when I wrote that. What I was saying is that EE also uses high quality wiring
And that is essentially what the SW is doing. Taking an A18 and upgrading all the internals while making tuning alterations to account for non-apex approach. As far as I know anyway.
 
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Jun 3, 2018 at 3:50 PM Post #10,249 of 39,419
I'm well aware it is a collab w/64, I want clear when I wrote that. What I was saying is that EE also uses high quality wiring
And that is essentially what the SW is doing. Taking an A18 and upgrading all the internals while making tuning alterations to account for non-apex approach. As far as I know anyway.

Ahh, I see. Apologies if I misunderstood your post. Shouldn't be too long now until we learn more about the revisions that the project has undertaken.
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 4:34 PM Post #10,250 of 39,419
Thanks for the feedback Collin!

Well, I don't want to sound like I'm being too harsh on the Zombie.

By way of explanation, the review unit arrived with only a 3.5mm single-ended cable. The only compatible balanced cable I had was being used to burn in my R1.

I actually messaged Sammy from Rhapsodio on here (Head-Fi PM), and also directly on the Rhapsodio website.
I was asking if he could supply a balanced cable for the review tour. Also a separate enquiry about a cable I'd seen on their website that I was interested in purchasing.

That was last week and I've still heard nothing. I was initially quite unimpressed, since this is my first time to encounter Rhapsodio and I seem to recall hearing good things about them and Sammy. However, I was invited onto the tour by a 3rd party, not Sammy, so I had little frame of reference.

So I was pretty disappointed by what seemed like a disturbing lack of customer service, and with regards to a TOTL product no less.
And with only a single-ended cable, I wasn't really able to use the most suitable gear to do justice to the Zombie's pretty unique signature.
Finally some sudden health/personal problems compounded it all for me, and having only just finished reviewing the Mason v3, I decided to send the Zombie straight on and give it a miss.

Since I didn't know what was going on with Sammy, I didn't want to flame him or the company on the threads here for lack of responsiveness without first knowing whether there were any extenuating circumstances (and I'm certainly not flaming them now, just trying to explain my less-than overly positive initial impressions).
Similarly, I didn't want to write a what probably would have been a very critical review without having had the chance to show the IEM's at their best through the right choice of AMP units on my DX200, cables and whatnot.

I suspect if I could whack a balanced EA Thor II silver cable on it and play it on AMP1 or AMP3 (DX200), I'd probably like it a whole lot more :D
Oh, and the Dita Dream had caught my eye before, although I've yet to hear it. Will give it a try maybe at CanJam London if possible :)

If you ever need to get a hold of Sammy, message him on the Rhapsodio Facebook page and I can all but guarantee you'll get a response in 24 hours or less, weekend or not.

I use the Zombie with the brightest cable I have: the RSD Silver mk3 (balanced). The Dwarf is too warm for it and the Golden is a different sound entirely. Like another member mentioned, it's probably not night and day, but I love mine with the silver and neutral sources. I guess that's obvious by my review, haha.

You may like the Galaxy V2 as well. Where are you located? I may have to create a private review tour just for you! :)

-Collin-
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 6:28 PM Post #10,252 of 39,419
Would you guys say fourte is best in resolution/clarity currently?

Bro, I'm only saying this with Peace & Love because I probably read *all* 476 messages you posted in Empire Ears thread over the last 1.5 years :wink:, but since 64 Audio offers a free loaner program in US, you will be better off getting Fourte and U18t to listen and to decide which one pairs up better with your DAP and the music you listen to. It doesn't matter what anybody else says or thinks, who cares? Be your own judge :D
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 7:27 PM Post #10,253 of 39,419
WooAudio WA8

I picked up a WA8 last week, to see if it could replace my Hugo 2, as I was starting to find my Hugo 2 a bit harsh with many of my albums. WA8's sound has a few strong characteristics. I am surprised that none of the reviews out there, have mentioned these aspects, and rather did the usual 'wonderful vacuum tube sound' dance. Actually, Currawong talked about the forward/engaging presentation and AnakChan mentioned the stage being narrow. But no review mentioned about the weirdness in the mid-range. Anyways, moving on..

The first aspect about WA8's sound that gets your attention is the strong bass. The bass is slightly enhanced resulting in a warm and slightly-thick bass presentation. But thats the not the whole story about its bass. This thing can slam like a s-o-b. Its an impact that you only come across in desktop amplifiers. And I am not surprised because, despite WA8's transportable form, its amp section is actually a fully discrete design, running class-A. What that means is, you can expect some of the benefits you get from a desktop class amp. And for the same reason, the unit runs quite hot and you only get around 4 hours of battery, as class-A designs are simply power hungry and dissipate a lot of heat. Another sound aspect you can expect from a good discrete amp is an open and airy soundstage, and the WA8 does have a spacious and an airy stage with excellent height and depth. But the width of the stage is quite narrow. So what you get is a high-ceiling-hallway shaped stage, that feels very spacious, even if its not monstrous in size. The presentation as a whole is placed slightly forward than neutral which gives a very engaging sound. I typically prefer a neutral placement but its not a big deal.

While these characteristics mentioned in the above paragraph can be desired or disliked, depending on one's preference, there is one more characteristic where the WA8 fails objectively, regardless of preferences. And that is the lack of body and dynamics in the mid-range. It's a shame because, the tone of the mid-range is very natural and realistic. With a forward presentation, the mid-range instruments feel right there and yet, it lacks the tangibility due to the lack of body. And to make it worse, the mid-range also lacks macro and micro-dynamics and thus coming across as soft. And when I try to crank the volume up to perceive the mid-range, the bass starts to overwhelm the sound. And when I do some EQ by adding some dBs to the center-midrange, there is a slight improvement in body, but the midrange still remains soft and intangible. So there really is no solution to this problem. The reviews talk about the tubey mid-range in the device. While the influence of WA8's tubes can be sensed in its tone and smoothness, you really don't get the full-bodied notes that most other tube amps typically offer.

Once you get past this mid-range issue, there is a lot to be admired and enjoyed about the WA8's sound. For example, the device just nails the tone. With a touch of warmth from the bass, a linear treble and a neutral-warm mid-range, the tone I hear on the WA8 is perhaps the best I've heard from a portable device in the sub-$2000 category. And I think we have to thank the tubes for that, because the tubes seem to remove any kind of edginess or hardness in the upper-midrange and treble, while retaining most details. And so, the amp has a very forgiving sound. The resolution and transparency are not WA8's strengths. Not that it lacks in those areas. It does have above average transparency and resolution, but devices like Hugo 2 and other TOTL DAPs outperform the WA8 in those regards and sound more precise. What it lacks in resolution and transparency it makes it up with its tone, stage and bass impact. Overall WA8 is a device geared for musical enjoyment.

Vs Hugo 2:
In comparison to the Hugo 2, WA8's bass slams harder and is overall warmer than H2's bass. H2's bass may be quick and clean, but it lacks the bass dynamics that the WA8 has. H2's midrange is more present and solid, and it also gets the cake for mid-range dynamics. Every little micro-dynamics is so easily laid out on the H2, while these micro-dynamics are soft sounding and are not quite easily perceived on the WA8. H2's lower mid-range isn't as thick as the WA8, but the overall body of the mid-range is better on the H2, due to the solidity and density reinforced by its centre-midrange presence.

While the WA8 goes for a smoother upper-midrange and treble, H2 is overall brighter, sharper and very detailed in that frequency range, supplemented with a better treble extension. Whether H2 is forgiving or not, will depend on the track and the headphones. But regardless of the headphones, WA8 is going to have an organic tone and a forgiving nature. H2 literally nails the presentation with a equally proportioned stage and a neutral placement. WA8 does sound a bit more spacious and airy, but the placement is a touch more forward. H2 does have better width, but the WA8 has better height. And both the devices have a similar depth. While layering is also similar on both devices, H2 gets the win for separation, resolution and transparency. Over all H2 sounds analytical due to its hyper-detailed neutral sound, that focusses on precision, while the WA8 goes for a musical presentation.

Conclusion:
In the end, WA8 is a really good AIO solution with a simple design, and a transportable form factor. It is not going to be as portable as a Mojo, nor is it feature-rich like a Hugo 2. But it does have a tubey character to its sound and certain qualities to replace your desktop DAC and Amp stack, provided you can overlook the mid-range issue. But for the asking price of $1800, the mid-range issue is something I can't go easy about. So if you know you will be using it mostly at your desk, I'd recommend looking into a different DAC+Amp stack. But if you are a frequent traveller or want a device with a smooth sound, that you could carry to your office and back, and can make peace with a soft mid-range, I can wholeheartedly recommend the WA8.

IMG_0324.JPG
 
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Jun 3, 2018 at 7:36 PM Post #10,254 of 39,419
I think the jump in performance between 240 and 380 was far greater than between 380 and SP1000. AK380 really wow'ed me upon first listen, but this was not as much the case with SP1000. At least, when comparing the two Cu versions. The regular AK380 and SP1000 (I assume the people you know tested the more popular SS) have different types of signature, so it indeed comes down to preference, although the SP1000 has more power and body to the sound. AK380 has a more natural, audiophile signature, where SP1000 SS has a more analytical and detail-oriented signature. I can appreciate the performance of SP1000 SS but I wouldn't buy it myself.

The Hugo 2 is in a way a step up from the AK and Sony. Its two main advantages for me are the neutral-done-right tonality, and its authority and control. Authority can be viewed as the ability to add substance to an image, the sustain and control of its body over time. This results in a more three-dimensional representation of a note. If a source lacks authority, it might be able to create an appropriately-sized image, but it falls flat too quickly. Simply put, it present the surface of an image, but it feels empty; it is a two-dimensional representation. The Hugo 2 provides a real drive behind its music, a solidity in its sound. The stage is more focused. All in all, you can say the sound feels more tangible compared to the top-tier daps.

The downside is that the increased focus seems to come at the cost of absolute stage dimensions. The AK and 1Z feel just a bit more open and spacious. I still have to ascertain whether this is due to the increased authority of the H2; if it is due to that when notes are more concretely crystallised in front of you, they just tend to feel closer. The daps in turn might just feel a bit airier because the sound is more diffuse. But in all fairness, I suspect it does not offer a great sense of depth from my initial listen. Overall, it is a reflection of how important stage dimensions are for that feeling of upgrade, at least with sources. If the H2 combined its sense of authority with a similar spacious feel, I would consider it an upgrade without hesitation. For now it is simply a worthy alternative with unique advantages.

In the end, they are each a mixture of variety of aspects, so it will come down to preference. In terms of performance I would rate them as follows (note: AK is Ultima Cu, 1Z is K-modded):

Authority
H2 > AK > 1Z

Resolution
H2 > 1Z > AK

Transparency
1Z > H2 > AK

Stage dimensions
1Z > AK > H2

Focus/Imaging
H2 > 1Z > AK

Tonality
AK > H2 > 1Z


ps. Seems like you have quite the yard sale going on, good luck with that!

Hey thanks man that is very helpful. I think I will skip on the Hugo 2, if you add in the fact that it apparently can sound harsh and I have a lot of badly recorded music. I have the Mojo which is fine as a USB DAC and maybe I grab the 380.

I am indeed selling a lot of stuff I bought to try and have now too much. I like to have a fairly focused set of gear or my OCD mind gets lost. The LPG I am only selling because I have a deal for a 2017 edition here.
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 8:24 PM Post #10,256 of 39,419
WooAudio WA8

I picked up a WA8 last week, to see if it could replace my Hugo 2, as I was starting to find my Hugo 2 a bit harsh with many of my albums. WA8 is a unit with a few strong characteristics. I am surprised that none of the reviews out there, have mentioned these aspects, and rather did the usual 'wonderful vacuum tube sound' dance. Anyways, moving on..

The first aspect about WA8's sound that gets your attention is the strong bass. The bass is slightly enhanced resulting in a warm and slightly-thick bass presentation. But thats the not the whole story about its bass. This thing can slam like a s-o-b. Its an impact that you only come across in desktop amplifiers. And I am not surprised because, despite WA8's transportable form, its amp section is actually a fully discrete design, running class-A. What that means is, you can expect some of the benefits you get from a desktop class amp. And for the same reason, the unit runs quite hot and you only get around 4 hours of battery, as class-A designs are simply power hungry and dissipate a lot of heat. Another sound aspect you can expect from a good discrete amp is an open and airy soundstage, and the WA8 does have a spacious and an airy stage with excellent height and depth. But the width of the stage is quite narrow. So what you get is a high-ceiling-hallway shaped stage, that feels very spacious, even if its not monstrous in size. The presentation as a whole is placed slightly forward than neutral which gives a very engaging sound. I typically prefer a neutral placement but its not a big deal.

While these characteristics mentioned in the above paragraph can be desired or disliked, depending on one's preference, there is one more characteristic where the WA8 fails objectively, regardless of preferences. And that is the lack of body and dynamics in the mid-range. It's a shame because, the tone of the mid-range is very natural and realistic. With a forward presentation, the mid-range instruments feel right there and yet, it lacks the tangibility due to the lack of body. And to make it worse, the mid-range also lacks macro and micro-dynamics and thus coming across as soft. And when I try to crank the volume up to perceive the mid-range, the bass starts to overwhelm the sound. And when I do some EQ by adding some dBs to the center-midrange, there is a slight improvement in body, but the midrange still remains soft and intangible. So there really is no solution to this problem. The reviews talk about the tubey mid-range in the device. While the influence of WA8's tubes can be sensed in its tone and smoothness, you really don't get the full-bodied notes that most other tube amps typically offer.

Once you get past this mid-range issue, there is a lot to be admired and enjoyed about the WA8's sound. For example, the device just nails the tone. With a touch of warmth from the bass, a linear treble and a neutral-warm mid-range, the tone I hear on the WA8 is perhaps the best I've heard from a portable device in the sub-$2000 category. And I think we have to thank the tubes for that, because the tubes seem to remove any kind of edginess or hardness in the upper-midrange and treble, while retaining most details. And so, the amp has a very forgiving sound. The resolution and transparency are not WA8's strengths. Not that it lacks in those areas. It does have above average transparency and resolution, but devices like Hugo 2 and other TOTL DAPs outperform the WA8 in those regards and sound more precise. What it lacks in resolution and transparency it makes it up with its tone, stage and bass impact. Overall WA8 is a device geared for musical enjoyment.

Vs Hugo 2:
In comparison to the Hugo 2, WA8's bass slams harder and is overall warmer than H2's bass. H2's bass may be quick and clean, but it lacks the bass dynamics that the WA8 has. H2's midrange is more present and solid, and it also gets the cake for mid-range dynamics. Every little micro-dynamics is so easily laid out on the H2, while these micro-dynamics are soft sounding and are not quite easily perceived on the WA8. H2's lower mid-range isn't as thick as the WA8, but the overall body of the mid-range is better on the H2, due to the solidity and density reinforced by its centre-midrange presence.

While the WA8 goes for a smoother upper-midrange and treble, H2 is overall brighter, sharper and very detailed in that frequency range, supplemented with a better treble extension. Whether H2 is forgiving or not, will depend on the track and the headphones. But regardless of the headphones, WA8 is going to have an organic tone and a forgiving nature. H2 literally nails the presentation with a equally proportioned stage and a neutral placement. WA8 does sound a bit more spacious and airy, but the placement is a touch more forward. H2 does have better width, but the WA8 has better height. And both the devices have a similar depth. While layering is also similar on both devices, H2 gets the win for separation, resolution and transparency. Over all H2 sounds analytical due to its hyper-detailed neutral sound, that focusses on precision, while the WA8 goes for a musical presentation.

Conclusion:
In the end, WA8 is a really good AIO solution with a simple design, and a transportable form factor. It is not going to be as portable as a Mojo, nor is it feature-rich like a Hugo 2. But it does have a tubey character to its sound and certain qualities to replace your desktop DAC and Amp stack, provided you can overlook the mid-range issue. But for the asking price of $1800, the mid-range issue is something I can't go easy about. So if you know you will be using it mostly at your desk, I'd recommend looking into a different DAC+Amp stack. But if you are a frequent traveller or want a device with a smooth sound, that you could carry to your office and back, and can make peace with a soft mid-range, I can wholeheartedly recommend the WA8.


Wonderful write up man. I love it and TOTALLY agree with you. I have heard every piece of gear they make and this is their house sound. It can sound great and I'd own their stuff if that's the type of sound I wanted or needed with a bright can (I'd change cans first, lol). If you are looking for a desktop in that price range, I'd get the Ayre Codex and not look back. Ethan from EE has heard it and I believe loved what he heard. I would love to see all IEM makers use these outstanding DAC/AMPS with their gear at shows. It's so easy for them to just use the Sony's, but I can' tell you that my Phantom's scale like heck wiht my Ayre QX5/30 DAC and my high end server. That tells me that they are soundly voiced as my DAC/Server/Amp is a top reference 2 channel system. My ZMF Ori's running balanced out of the Ayre make them sound so much better than any headphone played off a Hugo 2 or any top DAP. That shows how important the DAC/Amp/Source is. too many folks don't pay enough attention on this part of the chain. They just keep buying more expensive IEM's and they play them off a DAP that just isn't up to the standard they should have. Feel free to disagree with me on this, but if so, please come to my house and listen or better yet, I will give you 2 channel stores near you that you probably don't know exist. I turn Ethan onto one of the top stores in the nation, that is two exits down from Empire Ears adn he was in shock, lol.

I just love gear AND great music just like you guys. Hope I haven't offended anyone.

Mim................ Get the best used AK that you can afford. I promise you that with all your great IEM"s you'd be happy. I will say that if you want the best out of your IEM's at HOME, get a great desktop and stream Tidal, but make sure you have a great cable to connect to it. Since I have upgraded my Server/DAC I will be selling my Ayre that is a full digital preamp, streamer, balanced amp/DAC, lol...:wink:. Seriously though, you need to listen or talk with folks you trust who have heard specific devices along with what you are using to figure out the best solution. JMHO
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 8:35 PM Post #10,257 of 39,419
WooAudio WA8

I picked up a WA8 last week, to see if it could replace my Hugo 2, as I was starting to find my Hugo 2 a bit harsh with many of my albums. WA8 is a unit with a few strong characteristics. I am surprised that none of the reviews out there, have mentioned these aspects, and rather did the usual 'wonderful vacuum tube sound' dance. Anyways, moving on..

The first aspect about WA8's sound that gets your attention is the strong bass. The bass is slightly enhanced resulting in a warm and slightly-thick bass presentation. But thats the not the whole story about its bass. This thing can slam like a s-o-b. Its an impact that you only come across in desktop amplifiers. And I am not surprised because, despite WA8's transportable form, its amp section is actually a fully discrete design, running class-A. What that means is, you can expect some of the benefits you get from a desktop class amp. And for the same reason, the unit runs quite hot and you only get around 4 hours of battery, as class-A designs are simply power hungry and dissipate a lot of heat. Another sound aspect you can expect from a good discrete amp is an open and airy soundstage, and the WA8 does have a spacious and an airy stage with excellent height and depth. But the width of the stage is quite narrow. So what you get is a high-ceiling-hallway shaped stage, that feels very spacious, even if its not monstrous in size. The presentation as a whole is placed slightly forward than neutral which gives a very engaging sound. I typically prefer a neutral placement but its not a big deal.

While these characteristics mentioned in the above paragraph can be desired or disliked, depending on one's preference, there is one more characteristic where the WA8 fails objectively, regardless of preferences. And that is the lack of body and dynamics in the mid-range. It's a shame because, the tone of the mid-range is very natural and realistic. With a forward presentation, the mid-range instruments feel right there and yet, it lacks the tangibility due to the lack of body. And to make it worse, the mid-range also lacks macro and micro-dynamics and thus coming across as soft. And when I try to crank the volume up to perceive the mid-range, the bass starts to overwhelm the sound. And when I do some EQ by adding some dBs to the center-midrange, there is a slight improvement in body, but the midrange still remains soft and intangible. So there really is no solution to this problem. The reviews talk about the tubey mid-range in the device. While the influence of WA8's tubes can be sensed in its tone and smoothness, you really don't get the full-bodied notes that most other tube amps typically offer.

Once you get past this mid-range issue, there is a lot to be admired and enjoyed about the WA8's sound. For example, the device just nails the tone. With a touch of warmth from the bass, a linear treble and a neutral-warm mid-range, the tone I hear on the WA8 is perhaps the best I've heard from a portable device in the sub-$2000 category. And I think we have to thank the tubes for that, because the tubes seem to remove any kind of edginess or hardness in the upper-midrange and treble, while retaining most details. And so, the amp has a very forgiving sound. The resolution and transparency are not WA8's strengths. Not that it lacks in those areas. It does have above average transparency and resolution, but devices like Hugo 2 and other TOTL DAPs outperform the WA8 in those regards and sound more precise. What it lacks in resolution and transparency it makes it up with its tone, stage and bass impact. Overall WA8 is a device geared for musical enjoyment.

Vs Hugo 2:
In comparison to the Hugo 2, WA8's bass slams harder and is overall warmer than H2's bass. H2's bass may be quick and clean, but it lacks the bass dynamics that the WA8 has. H2's midrange is more present and solid, and it also gets the cake for mid-range dynamics. Every little micro-dynamics is so easily laid out on the H2, while these micro-dynamics are soft sounding and are not quite easily perceived on the WA8. H2's lower mid-range isn't as thick as the WA8, but the overall body of the mid-range is better on the H2, due to the solidity and density reinforced by its centre-midrange presence.

While the WA8 goes for a smoother upper-midrange and treble, H2 is overall brighter, sharper and very detailed in that frequency range, supplemented with a better treble extension. Whether H2 is forgiving or not, will depend on the track and the headphones. But regardless of the headphones, WA8 is going to have an organic tone and a forgiving nature. H2 literally nails the presentation with a equally proportioned stage and a neutral placement. WA8 does sound a bit more spacious and airy, but the placement is a touch more forward. H2 does have better width, but the WA8 has better height. And both the devices have a similar depth. While layering is also similar on both devices, H2 gets the win for separation, resolution and transparency. Over all H2 sounds analytical due to its hyper-detailed neutral sound, that focusses on precision, while the WA8 goes for a musical presentation.

Conclusion:
In the end, WA8 is a really good AIO solution with a simple design, and a transportable form factor. It is not going to be as portable as a Mojo, nor is it feature-rich like a Hugo 2. But it does have a tubey character to its sound and certain qualities to replace your desktop DAC and Amp stack, provided you can overlook the mid-range issue. But for the asking price of $1800, the mid-range issue is something I can't go easy about. So if you know you will be using it mostly at your desk, I'd recommend looking into a different DAC+Amp stack. But if you are a frequent traveller or want a device with a smooth sound, that you could carry to your office and back, and can make peace with a soft mid-range, I can wholeheartedly recommend the WA8.

Indeed great write up, thank god we have this thread for opinions other than OMG I CUMZ ITSOGOOD.

I now makes me less curious about the WA11 which had piqued my interest. At the same time it is solid state so could be quite different.
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 9:13 PM Post #10,258 of 39,419
Bro, I'm only saying this with Peace & Love because I probably read *all* 476 messages you posted in Empire Ears thread over the last 1.5 years :wink:, but since 64 Audio offers a free loaner program in US, you will be better off getting Fourte and U18t to listen and to decide which one pairs up better with your DAP and the music you listen to. It doesn't matter what anybody else says or thinks, who cares? Be your own judge :D
It very much does matter what other people consider in sound, as I don't get to try every iem in the world getting others opinions about it is the only way for me to *hear*, regardless of how much Zeus a$$ I've kissed over the past 1.5 years,, the industry advances and moves forward. And I'd like to as well
 
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Jun 3, 2018 at 9:33 PM Post #10,259 of 39,419
It very much does matter what other people consider in sound, as I don't get to try every iem in the world getting others opinions about it is the only way for me to *hear*, regardless of how much Zeus a$$ I've kissed over the past 1.5 years,, the industry advances and moves forward. And I'd like to as well

I wasn't referring to your arse kissing but your arguments in Zeus thread, Adel vs non-Adel and so on. My point, you have a specific taste, and in many cases you don't agree with other opinions, which is normal. When you are talking about $2k-$3k+ investment, you can read as much as you want about other opinions, but you have to hear it yourself and 64audio actually has a loaner program for anybody to try it. I think that's will be your best bet.
 
Jun 3, 2018 at 9:56 PM Post #10,260 of 39,419

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