[fjrabon]

  I am sorry if I misled the group with my post.  I actually have the o2/odac combo.  However, I appreciate the feedback.

oh, then, eh, you won't hear a significant difference, and certainly nothing that a tiny EQ adjustment wouldn't make nearly imperceptible.  it's probably a 2% difference in that case.  Again, it mostly comes down to how much that 2% is worth.  I like the sound of the Grace better, but the main reason I upgraded was the better form factor and additional features.

 

[ZooGambler]

Thanks for the reply chow! 

   
To begin with, while I think the 400i are decent headphones for gaming, they're not the best. They do have pretty good depth that will let you know whether something is closer or further away from you, but I find the somewhat narrow soundstage of the 400i to be a bit not to my taste. Though the bass will make explosions sound much better than on the HD598 (which I also have).
 
The 400i's are very clear, and have an accurate soundstage in that positioning/imaging is quite good on these, and overall the soundstage sounds coherent if a bit small for a open headphone. What I mean by "coherent" is that nothing in the soundstage feels out of place, everything seems to form together to be one cohesive whole.
 
Also, the 400i is very comfortable - the headband distributes the weight around your head very nicely, and the earpads are relatively thick and comfortable. Clamp may be a bit tight, but I think that is somewhat due to variances between units. The only thing is that the 400i will probably be heavier than what you are used to with the HD598 and the DT 770.
 
As for the 400i being suited to your music tastes, I took a listen to the song you posted with my 400i. Personally, I think it's enough, as the bass hits hard but isn't bloated and doesn't over stay its welcome. And the 400i puts out much harder-hitting bass than the HD598 does. But some people might think it's a bit lacking for hip-hop because its not enough, not that it doesn't hit hard.
 
Finally, what I believe people mean by saying that the HD650 being "dark" and "sleepy" is that the treble isn't really emphasized next to the mids and bass. So you get a more of a bass and mids-emphasis sound on the HD650. This also makes the HD650 more forgiving of poorly produced music (as badly produced music with screeching treble which is obvious on a treble-emphasis headphone is really grating on the ears).
 
Hope this helps! Feel free to ask any other questions.

I pulled the trigger on the HE400i's on Sunday and I expect them to be here by at least the 8th! Anybody do anything special with their box the phones come in? The packaging is so beautiful that I want to do something with it besides tossing it into my closet and forgetting about it forever. Seems like such a waste! Also is there a mod to open up the soundstage at all similar to that I've seen people do on earlier models?
 
Side note: I got my Schiit Uber stack today and wow, this is absolutely incredible! My first step into (subjective) hi-fi and I love it! Too bad college will restrain me to this and the new headphones I'm picking up for...the remainder of my life 

 

 

[aami2techie]

if anyone sees any sale or price drop of 400i (as i missed the black friday one damn) pls do share it with me, i want these so bad, as currently these are priced higher than HD 700

 

[beaver316]

  I am coming from a pair of Phillips Fidelio X2 and a Jds Labs ODAC to the HE-400i.  My question is how do you think the new headphones will pair with the ODAC.  Also, I am considering getting the new massdrop Grace design m9xx as a replacement to the ODAC?  What do you think?  Will it be a significant improvement?  Thanks.

 
I don't think it will be a significant upgrade. IMO the DAC has least influence in the sound chain, with the amp and headphone influencing the sound the most. Don't get me wrong, it has an effect, but not as pronounced as an amplifier can be. What you want from a DAC is for it to be as neutral as possible, and the ODAC succeeds in this. With that said, I use an ODAC with my HE-400i and it pairs great. If I were you, I would keep the ODAC, and use the money on good amp that can drive the HE-400i well. Audio-GD have some nice amps.

 

[automaton]

So being cheap here, but anyone tried the Monoprice DAC/amp or the SMSL SD-793ii with these?  I have the E17 right now, switch back and forth between that and the headphone jack in my vintage receiver that uses the DAC in my desktop (old Creative SB Platinum).  Looking to step up to a more desktop-friendly combo.

 

[bracko]

  I am sorry if I misled the group with my post.  I actually have the o2/odac combo.  However, I appreciate the feedback.

Honestly, I think you'll be fine with O2/ODAc + HE-400i.

 

[bracko]

 
1) Their specs are not the same.  different resistance, different sensitivity, different FR graphs, different THD measurements, different sine wave responses
2) Their drivers are NOT the same.  
3) The HE400S has a more resonant body (lower quality plastic on 400S) and grill (plastic vs metal), this is why it's not quite as clear as the HE400i, most likely.  
4) The HE400i isn't going to see a price drop unless the HE400S does too.  The HE400i is very clearly positioned by HiFiMan as an upgrade, not just a different product line.  It would make 0 sense whatsoever to make them cost the same, other than something like a very special black friday sale.  Sure, they likely didn't sell them at a loss, but that doesn't mean much.  Talking to some people from HiFiMan, fi they permanently sold the HE400i at $299, they wouldn't recoup the R&D costs.  The thing costs less than $299 to make per unit in manufacturing costs, obviously, but the real cost is a fixed cost up front R&D cost.
5) If you're not interested in the HE400i at its normal price, and can't wait for a sale or buy used, that's EXACTLY THE REASON THE 400S exists!  It's a great headphone.  It's not the HE400i. 
6) Companies do consider the price factor, heavily.  They put in a ton of R&D, and want to make a decent profit.  It's not like HiFiMan is making billions of dollars.  They actually, IMHO, charge the fairest prices of any company in the world.  I'd say the HE400i is a $799 headphone.  I'd say the HE400s is a $399 headphone.  I'd say the HE560 is a $999 headphone.  Their summit-fi flagship stuff is crazy, but that's summit-fi.
7) Yeah, I get that these headphones are a luxury item.  There was a long time in my life that I couldn't afford something like the HE400i.  But there are a lot of great headphones, not on teh HE400i's level, obviously, but headphones that can make you perfectly happy, for a third of the price or less.  I'd be perfectly fine if I could only afford a Grado SR60e.  it's a cool little can.  Of course the HE400i blows the doors off of it, but it's also a revolutionary technology that Fang has poured his whole life into, the SR60e has been basically the same for like 20 years.
8) If they cut their prices by the amount you are suggesting permanently, they'd have to slash their R&D budget.  And we wouldn't get the breakthroughs in technology we get now.  Fang puts jsut about everything HiFiMan earns back into R&D and it shows.  This is an incredible headphone at an incredible price, even when it isn't on sale.  

I would rate Hifiman headphones I've heard so far as follows:
 
1) HE-1000
2) HE-6
3) HE-500/HE-560
4) HE-400i
5) HE-400S/HE-400
6) HE-300
 
My ranking correlates quite well with the price

. The difference between HE-6 and HE560/HE-500 is quite small, as is the difference between HE-400i and HE-400S. 
 
I don't really understand why some people would say that HE-500 and HE-400i sound similar. HE-500 has far larger soundstage and is more detailed than HE-400i. It obviously also has better tonal balance and timbre. I can understand that there are people who prefer one or the other but they are not that similar and imho HE-500 is a little bit better buy (at $500). HE-6 and HE-500 are more similar in voicing but HE-6 is more detailed when properly driven. I think both HE-6 and HE-500 have nicer mids than HE-400i, HE-560 and HE-400S. HE-1000 is quite overpriced as every other summit-fi headphone and imho not worth its price. The real star in the current Hifiman production is HE-400i, no doubt. A really incredible headphone worth every penny. 

 

[Youth]

  I would rate Hifiman headphones I've heard so far as follows:
 
1) HE-1000
2) HE-6
3) HE-500/HE-560
4) HE-400i
5) HE-400S/HE-400
6) HE-300
 
My ranking correlates quite well with the price

. The difference between HE-6 and HE560/HE-500 is quite small, as is the difference between HE-400i and HE-400S. 
 
I don't really understand why some people would say that HE-500 and HE-400i sound similar. HE-500 has far larger soundstage and is more detailed than HE-400i. It obviously also has better tonal balance and timbre. I can understand that there are people who prefer one or the other but they are not that similar and imho HE-500 is a little bit better buy (at $500). HE-6 and HE-500 are more similar in voicing but HE-6 is more detailed when properly driven. I think both HE-6 and HE-500 have nicer mids than HE-400i, HE-560 and HE-400S. HE-1000 is quite overpriced as every other summit-fi headphone and imho not worth its price. The real star in the current Hifiman production is HE-400i, no doubt. A really incredible headphone worth every penny. 

 
I will listen more closely to your impressions now 

 

[Dionysus]

I received my HE400i yesterday from TTVJ but it has the older connector. Is there any advantage or disadvantage to the connectivity of this f style connector. I have not had a chance to listen yet but.

Should I keep them or return and request the newer model with the new connector? Thoughts?

 

[mysticstryk]

I received my HE400i yesterday from TTVJ but it has the older connector. Is there any advantage or disadvantage to the connectivity of this f style connector. I have not had a chance to listen yet but.

Should I keep them or return and request the newer model with the new connector? Thoughts?

It might be easier for you to find compatible cables? Idk, when I was looking for a new cable for mine, they were all mostly old connectors.

How sturdy is it? I find the stock 2.5 cables pretty flimsy.

 

[coletrain104]

  I would rate Hifiman headphones I've heard so far as follows:
 
1) HE-1000
2) HE-6
3) HE-500/HE-560
4) HE-400i
5) HE-400S/HE-400
6) HE-300
 
My ranking correlates quite well with the price

. The difference between HE-6 and HE560/HE-500 is quite small, as is the difference between HE-400i and HE-400S. 
 
I don't really understand why some people would say that HE-500 and HE-400i sound similar. HE-500 has far larger soundstage and is more detailed than HE-400i. It obviously also has better tonal balance and timbre. I can understand that there are people who prefer one or the other but they are not that similar and imho HE-500 is a little bit better buy (at $500). HE-6 and HE-500 are more similar in voicing but HE-6 is more detailed when properly driven. I think both HE-6 and HE-500 have nicer mids than HE-400i, HE-560 and HE-400S. HE-1000 is quite overpriced as every other summit-fi headphone and imho not worth its price. The real star in the current Hifiman production is HE-400i, no doubt. A really incredible headphone worth every penny. 

I'm mostly with you, except that the mids of the 500 are so smooth that it seems like a coloration. But it sounds SO GOOD. Idk, I like the 500 a lot. A member in my area got a lightly used pair for $200 and I have so much envy over that. The 500 soundstage is way bigger too. Where do you find them for ~$500?
 
EDIT: Just wanted to say that the HE-500 was my favorite headphone that I tried over the course of multiple meets, hearing most of the flagships including the Dharma. It doesn't try to be super technical, but goes like a nice speaker. Good bass weight, beautiful mids, spacious, and still has a lot of detail and good texture and timbre. Very liquid. I wish it weren't so heavy though.

 

[Sonic Defender]

^ The weight and comfort of the 500 was the reason I couldn't sink money into it. Still, if I found a set for 2 bills ....

 

[Sonic Defender]

I received my HE400i yesterday from TTVJ but it has the older connector. Is there any advantage or disadvantage to the connectivity of this f style connector. I have not had a chance to listen yet but.

Should I keep them or return and request the newer model with the new connector? Thoughts?

Really just a preference thing, there is nothing wrong with those connectors except for a little more work maybe. I would just leave my cable attached if it was safe and not give to hoots what the connector was. As some have said, you may find it easier to get cables for the old SMC connectors, but surely in time it won't be the case.

 

[maul]

Just want to say that even though the cups look good, this HP has some REALLY cheap plastic on it. It's probably the same as the 400S in some places - that Toys-R-Us plastic has no place on a $500 HP. One of my minor gripes. They sound amazingly clear and neutral though. 

 

[Nick727]

  Just want to say that even though the cups look good, this HP has some REALLY cheap plastic on it. It's probably the same as the 400S in some places - that Toys-R-Us plastic has no place on a $500 HP. One of my minor gripes. They sound amazingly clear and neutral though. 

 
Agreed 100%