[leeperry]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Landis /img/forum/go_quote.gif the general aggression and pomposity. Can't we all just get along?

 

[chi2]

I am generally pretty sceptical with regard to enthusiastic statements on inexpensive headphones blowing well-known heavyweights out of the water. So was I when reading about the modded CD1000.
 
Then, yesterday, I received a used but in good shape CD850, bought by auction for USD 20

. They share the same frame/headband-combo with the CD1000 and 3000. The driver, while being also 50mm, has slightly different spec (sensitivity 102dB instead of 104dB). The shape of cups is different from the CD3000, too. (Don’t know about the CD1000.)
 
While the plastic parts were in good shape the pads were completely gone south. I didn't expect much and in fact the sound was very bright with the (way too small) MDR-CD550 pads and some others I had at hand. The bass was far too recessed the highs rather piercing.
 
I then gave leeperry's mod a try - with the result of a still very unbalanced bass-light and treble-happy presentation.
 
Then today two sets of CD1000/3000 pads ordered last week were in the post. Not the original Sony ones but some third party stuff. And then came the surprise. Suddenly things fitted together and these cheap phones began to sing. And shine. I was and still am impressed. They are easily on the same level as the SR-225 and even come close to the RS-1. In fact they sound quite similar to the Grados with a very dynamic representation in the low registers as well as in the other ranges and with a high level of detail - and a larger soundstage. All this in a closed format! As you sure will be aware of, it is much harder to design a well balanced and open sounding closed headphone. The bass and dynamics are better than those of the closed DT770 PE (250 Ohms). In the upper ranges they even share some sonic characteristics with the DT880 PE (forward but clean presentation with mucho detail) but again are faster, especially in the low frequencies, and a bit less cold.
 
They are not free from midrange coloration and while not being sibilant they are just a tad too forward in the highs. Then again these highs are amazingly clean. Acoustic music and especially acoustic guitars sound spectacular on these - just like on the Grados.
 
The build quality admittedly is low, with cheaper materials than are used in the Beyers. Shame on Sony for not using the same stuff as for the F-1. But sonically they were the greatest surprise to me of say the last year.
 
So thanks leeperry for the description of the CD1000 mod!

 

[leeperry]

np, enjoy

when you hear what a cd850 can do, you realize that most $300 headphones nowadays are grossly overpriced.
 
the cd850 MSRP was $170: http://tinyurl.com/33p9wau
 
a fully modded cd850 can be quite close to the cd1k...I've A/B'ed them several times...the only diff is that the cd1k SS is much deeper and clearer, and the trebles are far more "HD sounding"...the cd850 uses a lower grade driver, and it's very audible. I can't bear the cd850 drivers for too long tbh(my brain starts its own kernel panic), but I've been listening to my cd1k for almost 15 years so I'm quite spoiled...the cd3k drivers just have magic to them 

 
I'd suggest swapping the drivers for something more serious tbh...I've got a stash of cd850's waiting to be modded, a bunch of genuine cd3k earpads and I'm expecting some d2k 50mm drivers within the end of the week...hopefully they will sing in a cd850 enclosure

 
I will create a thread in the DIY section when the mod is done, but no wonder the d2k is a bass fart when you see the construction of the cups...the driver can hardly breathe and there's a huge piece of rubber at the back of the cup : http://www.denon.fr/scripts/fo/elements/12448.jpg
 
I'm surprised Larry didn't give them the deep cup treatment: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/203802/i-didn-t-know-what-prat-was-till-the-cd3000-s/0#post_2449583
 
together with some j$ pads, this should really be something! and those denon phones already have angled drivers, the j$ pads are just drastically increasing the angle...I think these drivers will kill in a cd850 shell

 
also their diaphragm is made of microfiber, close enough to biocellulose huh?

 

[chi2]

I'm not so sure about the idea of transplanting the Denon drivers into the CD850. I mean the cups are really made of thin and cheap plastic. When I opened the CD850, one of the stands that hold the screws broke right away and had to be glued. Damping the cups of the Denon D2000 plus eventually creating some sort of a (well proportioned and damped) port may be the better approach to cultivate its bass.
 
Last weekend I had the opportunity to listen to a CD3000. Actually I planned to buy it for around USD 500. The CD3000 was seldomly used and had no scratch on the cups and the arc. But when I held the sticky mess of all those disintegrating pleather parts in my hands and found the arc to be made of plastic like with the CD850 and 1000 I had my doubts. And their sound left me clearly underwhelmed. There was less high end extension than I had expected. And at higher volumes the bass turned out to be somewhat distorted. The seller meant this may be due to the foam ring under the textile cover of the driver disintegrating but I feared the driver itself may be the problem. I let the CD3000 be and am now thinking of purchasing an ATH AD2000 which can be had for 499 new.

 

[leeperry]

yes, I've had two stock cd3k's in my hands, and I have no idea why anyone would pay this kind of money for those

 
the second one clearly had foobared drivers(major stereo imbalance), but the first one seemed perfectly fine...vintage phones are a luck of a draw(I did clean the front driver black foam in the last one I had).
 
BTW, how's the isolation compared to your k701?
 
there's other tricks to improve the bass response, don't be afraid to experiment and report back....you can use all kind of acoustic foam(that ppl usually put under their speakers to provide isolation) and the idea is to do like dynaxorb: http://www.dynamat.com/products_car_audio_dynaxorb.html
 

 
that's the reason of the rubber disc in the d2k.
 
Germania was banned, but she experimented with different drivers and apparently she really enjoyed the dx1k/w5k drivers in the cd1k enclosure...and to be effective you want drivers that were engineered to work angled, and that's the case of the d2k(same drivers as the d5k)....I'm cool with disassembling the d2k and soldering the cd850 cable on it, I just need to find a way to fit the drivers in the cd850, but they're both 50mm so if I'm lucky they'll just snap-in. Germania said on her profile that she came up with a "tray" system to roll drivers...but I guess we'll never know any further.

 

[chi2]

Will have to compare these this evening and report back. FWIR the K701 has mayor leakage/minimal isolation. I suppose the CD850 will provide some - albeit limited - isolation in both directions.
 
Quote:

BTW, how's the isolation compared to your k701?

 

[leeperry]

well, the cd3k isolation is bad...but my modded cd1k is really really bad(maybe that's why its SS is wider?)...I'm just wondering where your cd850 stands compared to your other mainstream cans(k701, hd600, dt880)?
 
everyone tells me that the k701 has a mind blowing SS and creamy mids...but the inexistent isolation kinda puts me off

 

[chi2]

The CD850's isolation is limited, albeit a little better than that of the K701 (which, however, is near zero). Low frequencies are even less blocked out than mid and high frequencies (which is common to almost all fullsize headphones as can be seen from headroom's isolation charts; some do even *increase* outside noise in the low freq range). The CD850 mod does change very little w/regard to isolation. While the isolation of outside noise is poor the leakage (from inside) is pretty low.

 

[leeperry]

oh, only a little better? coz right now I'm listening at low volume w/ the cd1k on my ears and I can hear myself typing...yes it doesn't leak too much to the outside but the isolation is pretty poor(I use the genuine cd3k ear pads, maybe it's even worse than your ebay pads).
 
the Manufaktur genuine leather DT770/600[size=medium]Ω [/size]had such an amazing isolation, my dog could bark all day I could hardly hear him

 
too bad the SS and PRaT were horrid...nothing's free down there.

 

[leeperry]

I'm currently trying the ebay pads on a modded cd850...because they're thicker, they seem to have increased the SS width by quite a bit

 
I will try them on my cd1k later, but that cd850 sure has a stellar bang for bucks ratio! it lacks the involving "HD-sounding" trebles, PRaTy bass and SS depth of the cd3k drivers, but the SS width is very very close and most impressive...especially for the low prices you can score them on ebay if you're lucky.
 
These pads feel less sticky but also more bulky...like a lower grade of pleather. OTOH, brand new genuine pads are also stiff, it takes a week for so for the sweat to loosen them. Isolation looks much better, I'll give them a week

 
the major bummer w/ the stock pads is that they flake out into tiny black fragments after +6 months...major PITA.
 
PS: I think they also increase the bass response!

 
PPS: haha, this phone sounds sooooooo much better than a d2k that it's ridiculous

 

[chi2]

How's your d2000-drivers-in-cd850-project developping? Did you get them (the drivers)? If so at which price and where from? Technically they seem to be gems: Their low distortion values and impulse reproduction abilities - according to the headroom measurements - are nothing short of impressive. They are on the same level as the T1 and HD800. Maybe they are being limited by the general design and tuning of the d2000.

 

[leeperry]

I got the d2k and already sold it...I didn't hear any potential in those(even w/o cups they sound ugly as sin..recessed mids/boomy bass/2D SS), all you can read is just shilly/clueless smoke IMHO. All those endless mods are just about "polishing a turd" as Uncle Erik would say...and that MOT who told me by email that a modded d2k w/ exotic wooden cups from the Styx river would kill a cd3k is just utterly laughable, and let's not mention the "I've sold my R10 because my d7k sounds better" 

 
anyway, I don't really like the ebay pads on the cd1k, really really stiff and too hot after a few hours..I'll put them under a whole bunch of books overnight...also they've changed the SS, but not for the best I think.
 
PS: hehe, putting the genuine pads on the cd1k is like waking up from a bad dream.

 

[Bush]

Just in case someone would be interested in a pair of Sony MDR CD1000, you can find them here  :
http://www.leboncoin.fr/image_son/707211777.htm
 
I own a pair of CD1000, and they are very close to the CD3000, even if the CD3000 are more realistic than the CD1000.