canfabulous
100+ Head-Fier
Thanks for taking the time to write out your thoughts (and to all the other helpful comments). Well timed as a I've just got a pair of Abyss on loan to try at home...
Vintage OG and Present Day TOTL Impressions
- Thread starter number1sixerfan
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paradoxper
Headphoneus Supremus
On loan. They ain't never goin' back!
canfabulous
100+ Head-Fier
Haha! Certainly true that they can't be unheard... !!!
lockjaw
100+ Head-Fier
Would love to hear more about 1266 TC vs Susvara battle
I can add to this
I was at CanJam NYC last year, Joe's son (from Abyss) was actually hanging out with us for a bit.
In the Woo Audio room, there it was. Abyss TCs right next to the Susvara
I'm trying to remember what the amps were, both top of the line, of course!
I had the TCs on, my buddy the Susvara. Listened for about 5 minutes and then did a fast swap. Within 5 seconds we simultaneously said "done"
It was literally that easy to tell the difference what a superior headphone the TCs are. The space around the TCs is just stunning, so holographic without losing any body in the mids. The bass is visceral. High are crystal clear.
Susvaras are great. They did win regarding comfort and weight. Smallish stage, nice detail, very linear. Honestly, if there wasn't a pair of TCs right next to them, I would be gushing over the Susvaras. In the end, I purchased a new pair of TCs. Sold off my STAX 007s and Utopias. Only complaint is the weight and some neck pain with long listening.
I also heard this 1266 TC and susvara at the Woo Audio room at CanJam this year. I think the TC was being fed by the WA33. I could be wrong about that.
My first time hearing both TOTL headphones. I was pretty blown away when Mike played me U2's Where the Streets Have No Name off the Susvara.
number1sixerfan
Headphoneus Supremus
Getting ready to make a longggggggg post lol with updated comparisons of the 009, TC, Susvara and Raal Sr1a. Before doing so, a few things to note:
-Spent the last week and a half critically comparing each of the above, average of about 2-3hrs a day
-I have no allegiance to any brand or any sort of gear, I try to be as honest and transparent as possible, while considering my own biases before providing insight
-We don’t talk about preferences enough, how do you evaluate my comments if you don’t know what I prefer.. so... I prioritize a prominent midrange (and vocals), clarity, detail, & soundstaging most of all.. with a preference of an airy and speedy sound, with weight to the sound (kind of counter to what I just mentioned but still) and decent bass (quantity, accuracy and extension). I can adjust to various tonal balances as well. The AKG K501 and Senn HD600 (really liked the HD650 as well) were my early first loves, and then the HD800 and AT ATH-L3000 were my only two cans and favorites for years (excellent compliments of each other).. and most recently the 009 and Susvara getting the most of my head time and the TC being extremely admired. So I see a lot of good in most headphones, can identify what I do and don’t like about them and use them in combination based on the mood/genre of the day.
-These are just my own thoughts, and again preferences play a huge part. That said, I'm going to be critical of each headphone. It is perfectly fine to disagree with me and I welcome it, but I am hoping to avoid immediate knee jerk defensiveness comments from people that have their personal favorite--I'm not trying to ruffle anyone's feathers. I'm providing an evaluation in hopes that it may help someone that's interested in buying or trying any of them out. These are all insanely good headphones and 4 of the top 5-6 to I have ever heard, period.
-Spent the last week and a half critically comparing each of the above, average of about 2-3hrs a day
-I have no allegiance to any brand or any sort of gear, I try to be as honest and transparent as possible, while considering my own biases before providing insight
-We don’t talk about preferences enough, how do you evaluate my comments if you don’t know what I prefer.. so... I prioritize a prominent midrange (and vocals), clarity, detail, & soundstaging most of all.. with a preference of an airy and speedy sound, with weight to the sound (kind of counter to what I just mentioned but still) and decent bass (quantity, accuracy and extension). I can adjust to various tonal balances as well. The AKG K501 and Senn HD600 (really liked the HD650 as well) were my early first loves, and then the HD800 and AT ATH-L3000 were my only two cans and favorites for years (excellent compliments of each other).. and most recently the 009 and Susvara getting the most of my head time and the TC being extremely admired. So I see a lot of good in most headphones, can identify what I do and don’t like about them and use them in combination based on the mood/genre of the day.
-These are just my own thoughts, and again preferences play a huge part. That said, I'm going to be critical of each headphone. It is perfectly fine to disagree with me and I welcome it, but I am hoping to avoid immediate knee jerk defensiveness comments from people that have their personal favorite--I'm not trying to ruffle anyone's feathers. I'm providing an evaluation in hopes that it may help someone that's interested in buying or trying any of them out. These are all insanely good headphones and 4 of the top 5-6 to I have ever heard, period.
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number1sixerfan
Headphoneus Supremus
General Impressions
SR1a – Just an insane wow factor. The overall presentation is unlike any of the others, without a doubt. Definitely the winner in clarity.. tends to feel like a veil has been lifted when listening to them after the other headphones. This coupled with the really amazing soundstaging allows the sound to just kind of exist freely in a way that the headphone feels as if it disappears. Also for the most part (wish the music was slightly more in front of me vs. in your head), every part of the music feels like it’s exactly where it should be. The separation is just incredible. Also, detail and Imaging are on par with the other headphones, but not discernably better (outside of maybe the Susvara). Lastly, extremely, extremely good with acoustic, vocal heavy, high detail/complex passages without a lot of bass.
Tradeoffs:
009 – Great wow factor (big sound, very prominent midrange), but slightly behind the Sr1a and TC in that regard (openness, holographic nature). However, it has the best overall midrange and best vocals, with a slightly forward sound. It is very detailed, airy yet with decent weight to the sound. Very clear and sparkly highs (sometimes to a fault, see below). Whenever I go back to this headphone from any of the others, I’m literally impressed within the first five minutes. From the Sr1a and TC, more intimate midrange and vocals.. from the Susvara, more clarity and bigger wow factor. The 009 is the easiest to adjust from the Sr1a, which is a testament of it’s clarity.. but even still it sounds slightly less clear than it. As far as bass, it’s really good and solid, but again with slightly less quantity and impact than with the Susvara. That said it’s definitely a step above the HE60, Sr1a, HD800, etc that are more so bass light (that is not a dig, I define bass light in relation to most other cans). Highs can get screechy at times, especially on poorly recorded tracks—easily it’s weakness that stands out. Generally, this still stands out as my main, top all-rounder. I do have to say though, the Sr1a and 009 are a bit redundant given what they do best. I would pick the 009 over the Sr1a overall if I had to, but that’s just straight up between the two. If I could only keep 3 out of these four, it would be really, really hard to decide between the 009 and Sr1a—right now they are my two overall favorites. But one of them would probably go.
Tradeoffs:
Susvara - very good at everything, but just one small step away from “wow’ing”in a single category (only in comparison to these* headphones). Really smooth tonality, neutral with a slight hint of warmth. That plus the comfort makes it easy to listen to them for hours on end. Also, great detail, excellent dynamics.. slightly smaller soundstage but sufficient, and with really good bass. This headphone reminds me of the Sennheiser HD650, just with a far higher level of performance. Remember the HD650 craze? People went nuts for it and it lasted for years lol.. It was a headphone that didn’t wow in any one specific category imo, but did everything so well that people were mesmerized by its overall balance. Also somewhat similar tonality wise.. that’s essentially the Susvara as a much better, TOTL can. Lastly, I want to come back to the bass, as it’s really, really good.. perfect quantity, very tight and articulate and good impact. It has slightly more bass and slightly more impact than the 009, and it feels just right. In fact, I wish the 009 had its bass. I only have the TC as slightly better overall bass wise..
Tradeoffs:
Abyss TC: The TC is a really amazing headphone. It has a wow factor that's right there with the Sr1a. It has the detail, speed and clarity of an e-stat, but with spaciousness and a lower end that only a few headphones I've ever heard can rival (namely the ATH-L3000 and probably the Grado PS-1 but it's been so long since I've had it). When you think about it, it's a really well balanced headphone given this combination. I believe the TC does imaging better than any other headphone, it really impresses me repeatedly. The width and depth of the soundstage specifically also really stand out, and to my ears is a bit better than the HD800 that is revered so much in this regard. I would only amend one statement from my original impressions I provided--I said it was more bodied than the 009, which in some cases is still true, but there is a very real (but slight) recession in the mids and upper mids, which does cause the midrange to not sound as full bodied or having as much presence as the 009 or Susvara. Over time this became more apparent and is the one flaw it has--but I've mentioned this before, slightly turning up the volume remedies this almost entirely.
Tradeoffs:
SR1a – Just an insane wow factor. The overall presentation is unlike any of the others, without a doubt. Definitely the winner in clarity.. tends to feel like a veil has been lifted when listening to them after the other headphones. This coupled with the really amazing soundstaging allows the sound to just kind of exist freely in a way that the headphone feels as if it disappears. Also for the most part (wish the music was slightly more in front of me vs. in your head), every part of the music feels like it’s exactly where it should be. The separation is just incredible. Also, detail and Imaging are on par with the other headphones, but not discernably better (outside of maybe the Susvara). Lastly, extremely, extremely good with acoustic, vocal heavy, high detail/complex passages without a lot of bass.
Tradeoffs:
- Less weight to the sound than the Susvara/TC/009, and certainly has the lightest bass of the three. Imho, these simply do not perform great with tracks with moderately heavy to heavy bass or with really low extension. And it’s not just quantity, I’m more so speaking quality. It’s almost as if it bottoms out at times and you lose some of the detail and clarity/tightness of the bass in comparison to the other headphones. (fyi the K1000, designed similarly, has the same issue)
- However, I believe a well powered speaker amp may help with this. The Woo WA33 as a pre definitely improves this to a good degree.. but at a slight decrease in transparency to my ears. Plan to explore in the future
- I don't listen to bass heavy music via headphones, I reserve that for speakers.. so for what I listen to it's almost a non-issue
- There’s one other tradeoff that’s worth mentioning, but it’s to be expected with the design. At times there’s slightly less intimacy and cohesion of the midrange—the 009/Susvara standout immediately in comparison here. I enjoy the SR1a’s presentation, but it also makes me appreciate conventional headphones. I wouldn’t own it without having the other.
009 – Great wow factor (big sound, very prominent midrange), but slightly behind the Sr1a and TC in that regard (openness, holographic nature). However, it has the best overall midrange and best vocals, with a slightly forward sound. It is very detailed, airy yet with decent weight to the sound. Very clear and sparkly highs (sometimes to a fault, see below). Whenever I go back to this headphone from any of the others, I’m literally impressed within the first five minutes. From the Sr1a and TC, more intimate midrange and vocals.. from the Susvara, more clarity and bigger wow factor. The 009 is the easiest to adjust from the Sr1a, which is a testament of it’s clarity.. but even still it sounds slightly less clear than it. As far as bass, it’s really good and solid, but again with slightly less quantity and impact than with the Susvara. That said it’s definitely a step above the HE60, Sr1a, HD800, etc that are more so bass light (that is not a dig, I define bass light in relation to most other cans). Highs can get screechy at times, especially on poorly recorded tracks—easily it’s weakness that stands out. Generally, this still stands out as my main, top all-rounder. I do have to say though, the Sr1a and 009 are a bit redundant given what they do best. I would pick the 009 over the Sr1a overall if I had to, but that’s just straight up between the two. If I could only keep 3 out of these four, it would be really, really hard to decide between the 009 and Sr1a—right now they are my two overall favorites. But one of them would probably go.
Tradeoffs:
- The highs can be offensive at times. It’s not a huge problem for me but on the wrong recording or genre it can be really tough. 90% of the time it’s not an issue, but the 10% can pause you right in your tracks. It is the one flaw the 009 has in my opinion and for people that are extremely sensitive to sparkly highs, this probably won’t be your favorite or a headphone for you. (fyi, I also think the combo of the Dave + BHSE exaggerates this, would expect a combo of say the Bartok/T2 etc to fair better, but not eliminate it)
Susvara - very good at everything, but just one small step away from “wow’ing”in a single category (only in comparison to these* headphones). Really smooth tonality, neutral with a slight hint of warmth. That plus the comfort makes it easy to listen to them for hours on end. Also, great detail, excellent dynamics.. slightly smaller soundstage but sufficient, and with really good bass. This headphone reminds me of the Sennheiser HD650, just with a far higher level of performance. Remember the HD650 craze? People went nuts for it and it lasted for years lol.. It was a headphone that didn’t wow in any one specific category imo, but did everything so well that people were mesmerized by its overall balance. Also somewhat similar tonality wise.. that’s essentially the Susvara as a much better, TOTL can. Lastly, I want to come back to the bass, as it’s really, really good.. perfect quantity, very tight and articulate and good impact. It has slightly more bass and slightly more impact than the 009, and it feels just right. In fact, I wish the 009 had its bass. I only have the TC as slightly better overall bass wise..
Tradeoffs:
- For me, it just doesn’t have a single or collective wow factor. Every other headphone owns one area that it “wows” in. TC? Bass and holographic realism. Sr1a? Clarity & presentation. 009? Midrange and Vocals. (However, again, every other headphone has more of a larger flaw while the Susvara does not, or at least not to the same glaring degree--so that IS its wow factor, although more passive so to speak).
- Soundstage is just a little more closed in than the other 3, but not a major issue at all
Abyss TC: The TC is a really amazing headphone. It has a wow factor that's right there with the Sr1a. It has the detail, speed and clarity of an e-stat, but with spaciousness and a lower end that only a few headphones I've ever heard can rival (namely the ATH-L3000 and probably the Grado PS-1 but it's been so long since I've had it). When you think about it, it's a really well balanced headphone given this combination. I believe the TC does imaging better than any other headphone, it really impresses me repeatedly. The width and depth of the soundstage specifically also really stand out, and to my ears is a bit better than the HD800 that is revered so much in this regard. I would only amend one statement from my original impressions I provided--I said it was more bodied than the 009, which in some cases is still true, but there is a very real (but slight) recession in the mids and upper mids, which does cause the midrange to not sound as full bodied or having as much presence as the 009 or Susvara. Over time this became more apparent and is the one flaw it has--but I've mentioned this before, slightly turning up the volume remedies this almost entirely.
Tradeoffs:
- Midrange recession - as mentioned, for me this is pretty big as the midrange is most important to me. It can sound a bit hollow at times and definitely has the least impressive vocals of the group specifically for this reason. But again, this can be remedied with volume--not saying that excuses it entirely, because that's not good for the ears and certainly it's not a headphone I use for low level listening
- Tonality - very small issue if one at all, but at times the TC can feel a tad cold. Could probably use just a hair of warmth, but not really an issue for me. For perspective, I would call the Sr1a the most neutral, followed by the 009 and then the Susvara being a touch warm. TC might be a touch colder than the 009/Sr1a and definitely a bit in comparison to the Susvara.
- Like the 009, the highs are sometimes* a bit of a problem.. but I believe slightly less of a problem than with the 009.
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number1sixerfan
Headphoneus Supremus
If I had to rate...
Wow Factor
Imaging and Soundstage
Conclusion
Once again, I have landed on one fact that I’m pretty certain to be somewhat objectively true---there just is no best. The comparisons back and forth actually were really stressful at one point, as over and over the flaws of each headphone became more apparent. I truly wish I could combine a few or all of them together for the perfect headphone lol. I do have the HifiMan Shangri-La Sr. on order and I am cautiously hopeful that it will takeover as king and fill that need, but I’m skeptical (although I think I’m going love it regardless). That said, at the moment the 009 is still my favorite, with it and the Sr1a dominating most of my time. Totally preference and will vary for others. I do also want to add two last tidbits: 1) if the TC didn’t have recession (and comfort) issues, to me, it would be the best headphone out and ever. I am constantly impressed by it, but it doesn’t get the head time as the others; 2) The Susvara is absolutely amazing. I don’t want that to be lost despite the wow factor aspect—again totally understand why people would own it only due to how so well balanced it is... ending it on this note, I'm extremely excited to get back to just listening to one or two headphones a night and to cease the exhausting comparison (and thief of joy process). Cheers.
Wow Factor
- Sr1a
- TC
- 009
- Susvara
- Sr1a
- TC/009
- Susvara
- Sr1a/TC/009
- Susvara
Imaging and Soundstage
- Sr1a/TC
- 009
- Susvara
- 009
- Susvara
- Sr1a
- TC
- TC
- Susvara
- 009
- Sr1a
- Susvara
- 009
- TC
- Sr1a
Conclusion
Once again, I have landed on one fact that I’m pretty certain to be somewhat objectively true---there just is no best. The comparisons back and forth actually were really stressful at one point, as over and over the flaws of each headphone became more apparent. I truly wish I could combine a few or all of them together for the perfect headphone lol. I do have the HifiMan Shangri-La Sr. on order and I am cautiously hopeful that it will takeover as king and fill that need, but I’m skeptical (although I think I’m going love it regardless). That said, at the moment the 009 is still my favorite, with it and the Sr1a dominating most of my time. Totally preference and will vary for others. I do also want to add two last tidbits: 1) if the TC didn’t have recession (and comfort) issues, to me, it would be the best headphone out and ever. I am constantly impressed by it, but it doesn’t get the head time as the others; 2) The Susvara is absolutely amazing. I don’t want that to be lost despite the wow factor aspect—again totally understand why people would own it only due to how so well balanced it is... ending it on this note, I'm extremely excited to get back to just listening to one or two headphones a night and to cease the exhausting comparison (and thief of joy process). Cheers.
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paradoxper
Headphoneus Supremus
Great impressions! I just realized no 007 inclusion. Definitely deserves a mention.
Great comparisons 
I’m surprised about how much you liked the sr-900. I’ve only owned one electrostatic pair of headphones, the Koss ESP-95x. You have piqued my interest in the Sr-009s though. Plus the BHSE gets great reviews.
I know I’ve mentioned it before, but I can’t wait to hear your impressions of the Shangri-la Sr
I’m surprised about how much you liked the sr-900. I’ve only owned one electrostatic pair of headphones, the Koss ESP-95x. You have piqued my interest in the Sr-009s though. Plus the BHSE gets great reviews.
I know I’ve mentioned it before, but I can’t wait to hear your impressions of the Shangri-la Sr
number1sixerfan
Headphoneus Supremus
Definitely, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I only limited impressions of it and the HE60 since I said I would focus on these four. Plus they're both just one step below these, albeit with the 007 being a bit closer than the HE60 is. Can't see myself giving either up, and certainly not the MK1.
number1sixerfan
Headphoneus Supremus
Great comparisons
I’m surprised about how much you liked the sr-900. I’ve only owned one electrostatic pair of headphones, the Koss ESP-95x. You have piqued my interest in the Sr-009s though. Plus the BHSE gets great reviews.
I know I’ve mentioned it before, but I can’t wait to hear your impressions of the Shangri-la Sr
I will say and reiterate, I have preferences that really fair well with Stax. And I only use my headphones for more complex and critical music so the Sr1a and Stax are really right up my alley there. One point of clarification. I have the base SR-009, not the 009s.. I'd love to hear the 009s, especially if it improves on the 009 issues.. it's just so hard. I can't see myself ever buying it given having the 009 lol.
And absolutely.. will share immediately after having the Shagri-la for a minimum of like a week.. I'm growing tired of waiting lol
The SR1a have better bass when paired with the RAAL HS1b.
https://forum.headphones.com/t/raal-requisite-hsa-1b-switch-drive-amplifier-review/9973
https://forum.headphones.com/t/raal-requisite-hsa-1b-switch-drive-amplifier-review/9973
Have you ever heard the HIFIMAN HEKse? With the CHORD DAVE/Upscaler combo, these are really great. The Utopia was on my list to sell but recently tried them on a SET tube amp and they open up with a much better, wider sound stage. I could never get into the STAX due to the dedicated expensive amps required. The TC is great but the industrial design, high price and mechanics of a good fit turned me off but perhaps after your great review will change my mind. As far as the Verite closed, I am very much in need of a closed back for late night listening at home and this may just be my wife’s best friend. I know they are more closed but all reviews suggest they sound the most open of any closed back out there and have the best balance overall.
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