[jamesjames]

I don’t disagree about 800S being better for classical (ie symphonies). I would say based on my limited experience with 430HA, I am not sure it’s a good fit for NDH30. I would use something like Gilmore lite or Oor

Yes, my experience in this field suggests that not everyone is looking for the same thing - or even remotely the same thing - in headphones or playback more generally. The very simple system I now use is the product of many years of buying, selling, buying again, selling again ... etc. And I recognise my preferences may be unconventional or idiosyncratic. My intention in posting on a site like this is simply to provide an idea of what I like and why, so that others who recognize a shared preference or perspective can follow up anything that might be of interest.

 

[Mike F]

@jamesjames I also have an SA-10. Headphone amp is a Lehmann Audio Linear SE. I also have an HD 800 and all I can say is that in general my findings of the NDH 30 are very much in line with @chesebert. I don’t generally listen to classical music (despite being a classically trained professional musician) and I can agree that the HD 800(S) might well be preferable for large orchestral works, but I’m also of the opinion that their tonality is not as natural or correct as the NDH 30 and their ability to reproduce intimate recordings is poor due to their ever-present expansive sound stage.
I find it very easy to understand why and how someone could think that the HD 800(S) was better than the NDH 30, but for me the NDH 30 is a better overall headphone in terms of tonality (timbre) overall frequency response (much better and more extended bass and more natural treble response) and general flexibility in terms of correctly representing what’s on a recording - they really seem to adapt and sound like what’s on the recording, as opposed to having their own sound. This may well come across as unimpressive to some, especially if they are used to something like the HD800(S).

I will note as a point of reference to my comments about tonality and timbre in particular that although I greatly enjoy my involvement here I primarily listen on full size monitors (speakers), and I’m fortunate to have some ATC SCM100ASL. I normally listen to CD or SACD. Pre amp is a Mark Levinson 38. All I can say is that the NDH 30 bring me far closer to the sound of that system than the HD 800 does.
I’m not trying to prove anything about the NDH 30 here - opinions will forever remain subjective - I just say this (some of which I’ve said much earlier in the thread) as a reference for my own perceptions and opinions.

 

[jamesjames]

@jamesjames I also have an SA-10. Headphone amp is a Lehmann Audio Linear SE. I also have an HD 800 and all I can say is that in general my findings of the NDH 30 are very much in line with @chesebert. I don’t generally listen to classical music (despite being a classically trained professional musician) and I can agree that the HD 800(S) might well be preferable for large orchestral works, but I’m also of the opinion that their tonality is not as natural or correct as the NDH 30 and their ability to reproduce intimate recordings is poor due to their ever-present expansive sound stage.
I find it very easy to understand why and how someone could think that the HD 800(S) was better than the NDH 30, but for me the NDH 30 is a better overall headphone in terms of tonality (timbre) overall frequency response (much better and more extended bass and more natural treble response) and general flexibility in terms of correctly representing what’s on a recording - they really seem to adapt and sound like what’s on the recording, as opposed to having their own sound. This may well come across as unimpressive to some, especially if they are used to something like the HD800(S).

I will note as a point of reference to my comments about tonality and timbre in particular that although I greatly enjoy my involvement here I primarily listen on full size monitors (speakers), and I’m fortunate to have some ATC SCM100ASL. I normally listen to CD or SACD. Pre amp is a Mark Levinson 38. All I can say is that the NDH 30 bring me far closer to the sound of that system than the HD 800 does.
I’m not trying to prove anything about the NDH 30 here - opinions will forever remain subjective - I just say this (some of which I’ve said much earlier in the thread) as a reference for my own perceptions and opinions.

I don't doubt your preferences. And, just to reiterate, I've never seen any point in seeking to convince others that my preferences are to be preferred! In fact, without getting too deep, I think in this area as in most others there will always be a plurality of views. I don't live in hope that one day everyone else will realize I was right all along!! The point for me is simply that anyone interested in these phones should understand that not everyone feels the same way about them - and I've tried here and in my earlier posts to explain what I like and why I think the NDH30 is good but not great.

 

[martel80]

I will note as a point of reference to my comments about tonality and timbre in particular that although I greatly enjoy my involvement here I primarily listen on full size monitors (speakers), and I’m fortunate to have some ATC SCM100ASL.

Now that you are mentioning your main monitoring system, I can definitely understand why you are attracted to the NDH 30 sound profile.

It really all make sense now.

Mid range mid range mid range.

I love working on ATC's. Very revealing monitors and so comforting.

 

[Mike F]

Now that you are mentioning your main monitoring system, I can definitely understand why you are attracted to the NDH 30 sound profile.

It really all make sense now.

Mid range mid range mid range.

I love working on ATC's. Very revealing monitors and so comforting.

 

[Plieb]

@jamesjames I also have an SA-10. Headphone amp is a Lehmann Audio Linear SE. I also have an HD 800 and all I can say is that in general my findings of the NDH 30 are very much in line with @chesebert. I don’t generally listen to classical music (despite being a classically trained professional musician) and I can agree that the HD 800(S) might well be preferable for large orchestral works, but I’m also of the opinion that their tonality is not as natural or correct as the NDH 30 and their ability to reproduce intimate recordings is poor due to their ever-present expansive sound stage.
I find it very easy to understand why and how someone could think that the HD 800(S) was better than the NDH 30, but for me the NDH 30 is a better overall headphone in terms of tonality (timbre) overall frequency response (much better and more extended bass and more natural treble response) and general flexibility in terms of correctly representing what’s on a recording - they really seem to adapt and sound like what’s on the recording, as opposed to having their own sound. This may well come across as unimpressive to some, especially if they are used to something like the HD800(S).

I will note as a point of reference to my comments about tonality and timbre in particular that although I greatly enjoy my involvement here I primarily listen on full size monitors (speakers), and I’m fortunate to have some ATC SCM100ASL. I normally listen to CD or SACD. Pre amp is a Mark Levinson 38. All I can say is that the NDH 30 bring me far closer to the sound of that system than the HD 800 does.
I’m not trying to prove anything about the NDH 30 here - opinions will forever remain subjective - I just say this (some of which I’ve said much earlier in the thread) as a reference for my own perceptions and opinions.

I can remember the same complaints about the original Bose 901 back in the seventies. 50 foot wide violins as an example. Yes im that old! Lol

 

[Rob80b]

Change of scenery last night and some non headphone listening, Tafelmusik performing Beeethoven's 4th and 5th conducted by Bruno Weil at the beautiful Koerner Hall.
Sorry no photography during the performance, sad as the enthusiasm and joy on the faces of the orchestra were priceless.

 

[Beagle]

For me dynamics are lacking on the Neumann, the leading edge appears to be missing and one feels more like a pedestrian.
Believe the bottom end seems be to the culprit, sounded congested and less defined in comparison to the HD800S, will check again also against the HD660S2, maybe try them on the Sennheiser HDVD800.
Overall the whole is more recessed, so lacking involvement, again more a monitoring tool than music enjoyment.

Not sure why comparisons to the HD800s ever materialized in the first place. They have nothing to do with each other. The HD800s creates a false illusion of space with exaggerated soundstage by placing the drivers well away from the ears. Closest Sennheiser comparison might be the HD 650 and HD700.

 

[Beagle]

Change of scenery last night and some non headphone listening, Tafelmusik performing Beeethoven's 4th and 5th conducted by Bruno Weil at the beautiful Koerner Hall.
Sorry no photography during the performance, sad as the enthusiasm and joy on the faces of the orchestra were priceless.

How was the soundstage?

 

[Rob80b]

And for something completely different....trying the HD630 pads on the 30's. Should mix things up. lol


....and with a little morning music from some other well known German composers..... a little Kraftwerk anyone?

https://tidal.com/browse/album/145210910

 

[Rob80b]

How was the soundstage?

I was obviously rather close to the orchestra but overall linear. : ) Funny though I always hear more depth and layering with recorded music. hhhhmmmmm???

 

[Rob80b]

Not sure why comparisons to the HD800s ever materialized in the first place. They have nothing to do with each other. The HD800s creates a false illusion of space with exaggerated soundstage by placing the drivers well away from the ears.

It's all an aural illusion but listening to both the HD800S and NDH30 side by side it is almost like comparing soccer to American football.

Closest Sennheiser comparison might be the HD 650 and HD700.

Almost tempted to pick up a used pair of HD700 as there have been a few on offer recently. I'd actually throw the AKG K712s into the mix.

 

[Beagle]

I was obviously rather close to the orchestra but overall linear. : ) Funny though I always hear more depth and layering with recorded music. hhhhmmmmm???

Exactly.

 

[Mike F]

I was obviously rather close to the orchestra but overall linear. : ) Funny though I always hear more depth and layering with recorded music.

On the HD 800S but not the NDH 30……..?

 

[martel80]

I was looking at the soundstage rating of my Q701 and the HD800S on the RTINGS website this morning.

Over time, I found that my decision making in that regards were underdone on the Q701 as they exaggerate the soundstage a lot.

it is a known thing for some AKG headphones.

First time I tried my Q701, I remember being overwhelmed by the width of the cans stating that it almost felt like I was inside , in the middle of an orchestra/band with stuff playing behind me at 45 degrees angle.

HD800S on the LEFT............................................................................................Q701 on the RIGHT

https://www.rtings.com/headphones/t...s-vs-akg-q701/290/703?usage=19&threshold=0.10

Looking at the ratings and their little info bubble explanation, it seems that both cans score very high in their own expectation of quality soundstage and imaging.

I would definitely disagree about the Q701.

Don't get me wrong though, I do believe that the Q701 deliver an incredible experience when purely trying to enjoy music but my experience also showed that they don't translate properly to other devices when making critical decision in a mixing situation.

Now, I would love for them to rate the NDH 30 as if I look at the HD650 rating both in imagery and soundstage, by their rating, they seem to believe they deliver an ''okay'' soundstage and good imaging while I found that the width translate very well but their depth is lacking massively.

Instrument separation is very important to catch details when mixing and the 650 make it a bit hard to hear everything in context.

It become mostly apparent when checking your mix in your car.